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Where can I find minor useful glamers?

Dwimmerlied

First Post
There seems to be plenty of scope in the literature for this sort of thing, but I cannot find it echoed in game mechanics. Has anyone else found this problem? What spell would enable me to make, say, a rusty tankard appear to be a jewel - encrusted chalice? Is there a spell that could make a disguise a door directly? What spell does Gandalf use when he momentarily becomes high and terrible?
 

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Sekhmet

First Post
https://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/lists/spells&tablefilter=glamer
https://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/lists/spells&tablefilter=illusion
Sorry!
If it isn't here, it likely isn't anywhere.

We have Illusory Wall for disguising a door (works wonderfully), Enlarge Person combined with Ghost Sound could work to imitate Gandalf's intimidation (but I'd allow Project Image to work just fine).

I'm not terribly sure of anything that makes one object appear to be another object (outside of Polymorph spells), but I'd be fine allowing Prestidigitation to work to that end for non-magical items.
 

Dwimmerlied

First Post
Thanks for the reply! Unfortunately those links aren't working, I'll try again later. Prestidigitation is actually an excellent idea I hadn't considered.

I was just searching now, and a really really old post on these boards mentioned the same thing, quoting Skip Williams as saying that object-affecting glamers are high level. Anyone have any idea why?
 

Celebrim

Legend
There seems to be plenty of scope in the literature for this sort of thing, but I cannot find it echoed in game mechanics. Has anyone else found this problem?

Not until you mentioned it.

What spell would enable me to make, say, a rusty tankard appear to be a jewel - encrusted chalice?

D&D 3rd edition seems to have made a concious choice to limit glamers to disguising individuals and not objects. I confess I never really noted it until you mention it. Looking over the illusion spell list, there is a distinct lack of variaty in the spell effects. I think I'll remedy that.

The closest I can find in the official canon is 'Deceptive Facade' from complete mage, but the problem with the spell - and probably the reason that 3rd edition hasn't dealt with this issue properly - is the spell has a distinct lack of mechanics to handle the consequences of a disguise. In particular, I'd want some sort of interaction with the appraise skill to detect cheating object value. But in general, other than changing assumptions, the main effect I can see of glamers of this sort is that they have a very wide effect on skill use in the environment. I think I'll write up a new illsuion spell series this weekend.

What spell does Gandalf use when he momentarily becomes high and terrible?

I have a cantrip called 'Coil the Shadows' that makes you momentarily appear large and menancing, granting you a bonus on your intimidation checks.
 
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Empirate

First Post
Probably a balance thing, to make sure PCs don't get too much ahead of the curve where spendable gold is concerned. Your tankard idea implies that you've thought about that :p.

How that makes sense in comparison to item creation feats and stuff like Wall of Iron, Flesh to Salt etc., I have no idea (or even just breaking up a ladder into its - more valuable - component poles...), but that's another discussion.
 

Dwimmerlied

First Post
Yeah I did wonder if that might be the issue... Characters tend to see everything with "-gp" for pupils. Perhaps that's the only reason after all, a little arbitrary tho if it is!

I had a look at Deceptive Facade; I had no idea that existed, but I think its exactly what I'm after. That book must have been a relatively late release? It's a shame that there isn't a spell chain similar to the image figment spells with Facade as the essenital basis.
 

Dwimmerlied

First Post
I suppose I could house rule something similar to your coil, Celebrim. Cantrips should be able to do such things, I think. A higher level version might emulate Galadriel's "high and terrible" moment as she is tested with the ring.
 

Celebrim

Legend
I had a look at Deceptive Facade; I had no idea that existed, but I think its exactly what I'm after. That book must have been a relatively late release? It's a shame that there isn't a spell chain similar to the image figment spells with Facade as the essenital basis.

The big problem seems to be that the designers could never figure out how to represent the effects of the spell mechanically. This IMO was a result of never fully embracing the skill system as a tool, particularly with regard to the design of spells. They also tended to write spells in the 1st edition style where the spell either is an attack or it has a binary absolute effect, rather than having a mechanical impact outside of combat. It's almost like they forgot they invented a system for arbitrating the effects of actions outside of combat.

If you look over the Illusion glamer spell list, they are all variants of the 'Disguise Self' mechanic. They increase in range, number of allowed targets, and duration as they increase in level but fundamentally they are all 'Disguise Self'. The designers had a clear sense that person effecting glamors could be handled by interacting with the 'disguise' skill, but never seemed to figure out the more complex interactions for objects and so never went there.

Anyway, thinks for bringing this oversight to my attention. I hadn't actually played an Illusionist in 3rd edition, and moreover had never had a player specialize as an Illusionist, so this hadn't really struck me. Now I think I see why there wasn't much interest.
 
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Celebrim

Legend
Disguise Object
Illusion (Glamer)
Level: Brd 1, Sor/Wiz 1
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Duration: 1 hour/level (D)
Range: Touch
Target: One object
You alter the appearance of a single unattended object, but not its physical properties. The object can occupy no more than 2 cubic feet per level of the caster, and must form a single continuous object whose discrete parts (if any) must be permanently associated with each other. A pile or collection of smaller objects must be modified individually. You may alter the object’s appearance however you will, to give it any outward appearance you desire provided it appears to be roughly of the same size and shape. Minor features can be added or obscured but these changes have no tangible form. The object acquires none of the auditory, tactile, thermal or olfactory properties of the object it is disguised as, nor can the object actually illumine its surroundings. The objects weight remains unchanged.
If the disguised object’s true tactile or thermal properties are not similar to those suggested by the object it is disguised at, it is immediately recognized as an illusion once it is closely physically inspected. However, if the tactile properties of the object are mostly similar – for example both the real object and the illusionary object are hard and smooth – then recognizing the illusion becomes a more difficult matter. Anyone interacting with the object has a -10 penalty on their Appraise check to recognize and correctly describe the properties and value of the object. If this check is successful, the illusion is automatically penetrated. If the check is not successful, the creature receives a Will save to recognize the trick. This magic can also be used to hide or disguise hidden or concealed features of an object, such as hiding writing or hidden panels. If used in this manner, the difficulty of any Spot or Search check to notice these features is increased by 5.

Mundane Mantle
Illusion (Phantasm) ) [Mind-Affecting]
Level: Brd 0, Sor/Wiz 0
Components: V
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Duration: 1 hour/level (D)
Target: Self
Save: Will partial
You cloak yourself in an illusion that hides your distinguishing features from the minds of observers. Any observer that sees you must make a Will save, or be unable to accurately recall your features. Instead, the will only be able to remember and describe you in the most generic terms, and will be uncertain regarding and often resort to inventing details if asked to recall them. For example, an observer which failed their save would be unable to accurately recall the hair color or height of the observer. If forced to remember specific details, they will imagine whatever is the most common and ordinary sort of hair color and report that you were of medium height and build, regardless of your actual height. Other observers when pressed will invent other generic imagined details that need not agree with any other observers. Observers, even ones that know you, will not recognize you unless you reveal yourself to them verbally or by some other explicit sign. Likewise, if you call attention to a held object or garment of clothing, an observer will be able to remember that you had such an item, but they will not necessarily be able to describe it. For example, if you draw a sword or attack an NPC, they will remember that you had a sword but would not be able to recall any specific details about its appearance or craftsmanship. This protection lasts from the beginning of the spell to the end of its duration.
Note that if you give your identity to someone who knew you from before the duration of the spell, they will be able to describe you based on any accurate former memories that they have.
Regardless of whether the save is successful or not, use of this spell grants a +5 enchantment bonus on any attempt to disguise yourself as a non-descript generic person, and increases the difficulty of a Spot check to pick you out in a crowd or public setting by 5.

Apply Glamer
Illusion (Glamer)
Level: Brd 2, Sor/Wiz 2
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Target: 1 unattended object or creature
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5ft./2 caster levels)
Duration: 1 hour/level (D)
Save: Will negates
If cast on an object, this spell duplicates the effects of Disguise Object. If cast on a creature, this spell duplicates Disguise Self except as noted. If the target is unwilling, a Will saving throw is allowed to negate the spell.

Disguise Room
Illusion (Glamer)
Level: Brd 2, Sor/Wiz 2
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 full round
Range: Close (25 ft. +5 ft./2 caster levels)
Area of Effect: 1 10’ cube per caster level
Duration: 1 hour/level (D)
This spell duplicates the effects of disguise object, except that it effects all unattended objects in the area of effect. The area of effect must be a continuous area within the range of the spell, and all effected objects must be completely enclosed within the area of effect. The ground, walls, and floor touching or contained within the area of effect may likewise be disguised. Note that in general, this spell cannot be used to completely hide a door or similar physical feature from observation, but it can disguise the nature of such a door – making a wooden door appear to be metal or the reverse. The spell can be used to render already concealed or hidden doors more difficult to detect, by hiding the small features that give away their presence. If used in this manner, the difficulty of a spot or search check to find such a door or other physical feature is increased by 5.

Improved Glamor
Illusion (Glamer)
Level: Brd 2, Sor/Wiz 2
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Touch
Target: One Object
Duration: 1 hour/level (D)
This spell duplicates the effects of disguise object, except that it includes tactical, auditory, olfactory and thermal effects. Additionally, the object may be made to seem up to 50% larger or smaller, or seem 50% larger or heavier than it actually is. Thus, the object may be disguised as object generally different and form and appearance than the real item, and the item will survive most casual inspections and will not reveal itself as an illusion unless a Will save when interacted with or a successful Appraisal skill check is made. However, the actual physical properties of the object are unchanged. The object may still not shed useful illumination. Carried objects will have their real encumbrance despite the appearance of being lighter or heavier, and so may suggest their real nature by long use. Objects retain their real shape, hardness, and hit points and can be revealed if they employed in ways not suited for their actual form, such as a stick disguised as a sword or leather satchel disguised as a shield or a bit of clay disguised as a candle. In such cases a new saving throw is allowed for each attempted use of the object not suited to its real form.

Confound Senses
Illusion (Phantasm) [Mind-Affecting]
Level: Brd 3, Sor/Wiz 3
Components: V
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Duration: 1 minute/level (D)
Range: Long (100' + 10'/caster level)
Target: 1 creature per 3 caster levels, rounded up.
Save: Will negates
This spell makes one or more creatures unable to perceive your presence by ordinary means by removing your image from their minds. If they fail their Will saving throws, you become to them invisible and inaudible and emit no odor that they can perceive for the duration of the spell. Your presence can still be revealed by any alterations you make in the environment, or by any solid or forceful touch, but the difficulty of the Spot check to note when you lift an object off an effected target is increased by 5.

Phantasmal Lure
Illusion (Phantasm) [Mind-Affecting]
Level: Brd 2, Sor/Wiz 2
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Duration: 1 hour/level
Range: Close (25 ft. +5 ft./2 caster levels)
Area of Effect: 5’ cube of space
Save: Will negates
You imbue a particular area with a pernicious mental trap that deceives whoever observes it that fails a Will saving throw, into seeing something which they most expected or most desired to find in this particular place. For example, a person seeking a treasure, upon observing the space may see the treasure they desire, while another seeing an empty bed may instead see the person they expect to be in the bed reposing in it. The viewer themselves fills in the details of the illusion with whatever most fits their expectations in the context of the trap, filling in any auditory, visual, olfactory, or tactile evidence of their delusion – up to and including making up reasonable conversation for an imagined person. A new saving is allowed whenever the victim explores a new sensory aspect of their delusion – touching what was previously unseen, smelling what was previously at a distance, etc.
Because the illusion exists only in the minds of the observers, it cannot violate any physical laws, but victims will generally try to rationalize any interaction that takes place until they pass their saving throw.
If multiple viewers see the same phantasmal lure simultaneously, they each will initially see a different thing. The trap is so insidious that if one victim describes what they see or have seen to another, that person will then expect to see what has been described and so see vaguely the same scene just as it was described if they also have failed the their saving throw. Even if two viewers that initially see different scenes describe what they see to each other, they two viewers will come to believe that each is describing different aspects of the same scene and only noticing the new details as their companion points them out. For example, if one initially sees kegs of fine ale, and another initially sees overflowing chests of treasure, when each describes the scene they will then suddenly notice the previously unseen ale and treasure and imagine the new features. However, if two viewers see details that completely contradict each other and cannot be reconciled – one sees the corpse of an enemy and another sees the same person alive – each victim is allowed a new saving throw when the contradiction is revealed. In such cases, the victim may believe everyone else is the victim of a powerful illusion, other than themselves, or they may delude themselves into believing that they were formerly deluded by wishful thinking.
Note that the caster has no direct control over what is viewed, but can provide hints by altering the context of the area. For example, a caster wishing someone to view a rich treasure, could likely suggest that by leaving a real chest and a few scattered copper coins in the area of the phantasm. Ultimately however, what is actually seen by the observer is up to the DM based on the character’s mental state and private desires.
The material component of this spell is a loose bundle of fine threads scented with a drop of perfume worth at least 1 g.p.
This spell can be made permanent with the permanency spell at the cost of 1000 XP.

Phantasmal Disguise
Illusion (Phantasm) [Mind-Effecting]
Level: Brd 3, Sor/Wiz 3
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 full round
Range: Personal
Target: You
Duration: 10 min./level (D)
Saving Throw: Will negates
You place an illusion around yourself that causes you to appear to the viewer to be someone that they trust implicitly and expect to see in the current situation. For example, a guard in a prison may see you as a trusted comrade or their captain. A person in a home may see you as a family member or trusted servant, depending on whomever they can most easily rationalize being present. This person can be up to a foot taller or shorter than yourself, be thinner or fatter, of a different race or otherwise. Your mannerism, voice, facial appearance and dress automatically assume the form that the person expects, however you do not acquire any of the person’s knowledge, languages, or skills. The net effect is if you had disguised yourself as someone known to the victim, with no penalties for differing gender, race, or age category and no bonuses to their spot check based on how familiar they are with the target, and with a +10 enchantment bonus on your disguise check. You may even successfully impersonate someone you have not met in this manner, since the details of the disguise are being supplied by the mind of the viewer. However, it should be noted that it may not be immediately clear whom the victim takes you for.
If multiple viewers see the same phantasmal disguise simultaneously, they each will initially see a different person and if they become aware that another viewer takes you for someone else, they are allowed a new saving throw. If this saving throw is failed, they will rationalize that they were mistaken and lead astray by their own expectations, and come to see you according to the cues provided by the other person. However, because each victim sees what they most expect to see, if a victim introduces you to another victim, the new victim’s expectations will be set by the cues provided and so they will if they fail their saving throw identify you as the same person.
Note that the caster has no direct control over what is viewed, but can provide hints by altering their costume or disguise. For example, a caster wishing someone to view them as a trusted manservant is likely to succeed in this desire if they dress in the appropriate attire, while a caster wishing someone to view them as their superior can suggest this by appearing richly dressed or in the appropriate uniform. Ultimately however, who is actually seen by the observer is up to the DM based on the character’s mental state and private desires.
The material component of this spell is a loose bundle of fine threads scented with a drop of perfume worth at least 1 g.p.

Shadowy Creation
Illusion (Shadow)
Level: Sor/Wiz 3
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 full round
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5ft./2 caster levels)
Duration: See text
Saving Throw: Will partial
This spell generally conforms to the effects of Major Creation, but the thing so created is only partially real. The maximum real weight of the object is 8lb per cubic foot, the maximum hardness is 2, and the maximum hit points is just 4 per cubic foot of material. Any damage inflicted by the item, such as if a shadowy weapon is formed or a collapsing stone wall, is limited to 1d4. Weapons will be fragile and will break after use. The item will however appear real to an observer unless the person receives evidence of the object not behaving in a manner consistent with its apparent nature – such a brick wall proving to be flimsy or an apparently heavy table being easily moved. Only with such evidence does a person receive a saving throw to see the illusion for what it is.
The material component of this spell is a drachm of oil.

Programmed Glamer
Illusion (Glamer)
Level: Brd 4, Sor/Wiz 4
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Touch
Target: One object
Duration: See below
Except as noted, this spell functions like Improved Glamer.
There are two basic operations of this spell. With the normal operation, the spell remains permanently quiescent until triggered and then lasts for 1 hour per caster level after being triggered. With the reverse operation, the spell remains permanent until triggered, at which point it is dismissed. The particular mode of operation is specified at the time of casting.
In either mode, you set the triggering condition when casting the spell. The event that triggers the illusion can be as general or as specific and detailed as desired but must be based on an audible, tactile, olfactory, or visual trigger. The trigger cannot be based on some quality not normally obvious to the senses, such as alignment.
The material component of this spell is a bit of powdered semiprecious stone worth 5 g.p.

Daydream
Illusion (Phantasm) [Mind-Affecting]
Level: Brd 4, Sor/Wiz 4
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Duration: 1 hour/level
Range: Medium (50 ft. +10 ft./caster level)
Target: One creature
Save: Will negates
The target of this illusion creatures for themselves a private and thoroughly engrossing fantasy which they experience as being fully real. The exact nature of the fantasy depends on the creature effected and the context in which the fantasy begins. It could be as simple as imagining that they heroically defeat their enemies, capture them, plunder them and savagely torture them, or it could be something as elaborate as receiving a visit from a close friend and spending the afternoon drinking wine and engaged in stimulating intellectual conversations. During the fantasy, the victim will have only the vaguest notion of the passage of time, as they will be so enjoying themselves that the time will seem to pass by unobserved. Whatever the fantasy, it is a fulfillment of their innermost desires and they so greatly desire it to be true and they are so thrilled or comforted by it that they will not willingly interrupt the fantasy unless forcefully distracted and drawn out from it.
Each hour that passes without interruption, the victim will be entitled to a new saving throw to resist the effects of the illusion. Otherwise, the illusion can possibly disrupted if an ally actively questions the existence of the day dream, or if an enemy attacks the dreamer. In either case, a new saving throw is allowed, but if the saving throw is failed the daydreamer will simply accommodate the intruders as much as possible within the context of the daydream.
The material component of this spell is a sprig of dried sticklewort.
 
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Greenfield

Adventurer
I'd be inclined to allow either Prestidigitation or some Cantrip specific to the task to mask the appearance of a held object.

As soon as the caster lets go of the object, the spell ends. Attempts to do things like, "I drop the glamered coin/jewel into his purse, so he can't see it change back" should require a Slight of Hand or Bluff check. (Bluff at -5).

I'd prefer that we not add new functions to prestidigitation, which is already "screw with everything" though.

As for Gandalf's "Great and Terrible" appearance? Looks like a Scare or Cause Fear spell with a good PR agent to me. :)
 

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