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D&D General Why is "OSR style" D&D Fun For You?

overgeeked

B/X Known World
Then yes! Many people find that 5e's mechanics get in the way of at least some of these principles, and that in many cases the best answer is on your character sheet rather than something that emerges in play. But given that 5e was in part inspired by the OSR, I see no reason why a 5e game couldn't veer in that direction.

Here's a good post about it
Weird. A lot of people were wrong then about 5E being "inspired by" the OSR. Basically all the staples of the OSR and old-school play are obviated as baseline in 5E. Must be the passing nod to "rulings not rules" that's the "saving grace" of 5E.
 

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Weird. A lot of people were wrong then about 5E being "inspired by" the OSR. Basically all the staples of the OSR and old-school play are obviated as baseline in 5E. Must be the passing nod to "rulings not rules" that's the "saving grace" of 5E.
Just because you can do other things with 5e doesn’t mean you can’t play it like 1e (or at least how we played). Everything in this thread supports the idea that we play 5e very OSR style.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
Just because you can do other things with 5e doesn’t mean you can’t play it like 1e (or at least how we played). Everything in this thread supports the idea that we play 5e very OSR style.
Then you and I played AD&D very, very differently. Everything that we enjoyed about AD&D is hand-waved or minimized out of 5E.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
Weird. A lot of people were wrong then about 5E being "inspired by" the OSR. Basically all the staples of the OSR and old-school play are obviated as baseline in 5E. Must be the passing nod to "rulings not rules" that's the "saving grace" of 5E.
Link from the quoted article...the AMA on Reddit. From Mike Mearls.
Mike Mearls said:
The concept behind the OSR - lighter rules, more flexibility, leaning on the DM as referee - were important. We learned a lot playing each edition of D&D and understanding the strengths and weaknesses each brought to the table.

Similar to the OSR, I think indie games bring lighter rules via focus and an emphasis on storytelling to the table that we learned a lot from. While a traditional RPG like D&D by necessity has a much broader focus than traditional indie games, there's a lot to learn there in being clear and giving people a good, starting goal or framework to work within.

For OSR stuff, we drew directly on older editions of D&D. In terms of indie games, or games cut from that cloth, Dungeon World, FATE, and the GUMSHOE engine leap to mind.
Yes, 5E is lighter than, more flexible than, and leans more on the referee than 4E or 3X. The OSR is about so, so much more than those three things.
 


I would agree that for me 5e obviates some of the need for player skill, partly through mechanics and partly through the play style evident even in adventures like the Lost Mines of Phandelver. Mechanics such as cantrips are extremely powerful relative to what OS characters can do, and come at no cost. Characters quickly acquire an array of special abilities that can help them navigate exploration and combat challenges. Meanwhile, there is a strong expectation that encounters will be balanced and appropriate to level.

That's just me though. I'm sure plenty of people play 5e in a more old school way and manage somehow
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
Maybe, or maybe we play 5e very differently than you do? What did you like about AD&D?
All this…
As a player, at it's core, it's more challenging and it's more reliant on me as a player. The mechanics are harsher with death far more frequent than modern expectations, so that forces me as the player to think more. I as a player have to think and work out puzzles; I have to think of tactics and strategies, ways around combat, or how to defeat an enemy before rolling the dice; I have to describe things well or I might miss something; I have to think and ask questions or I might miss something; I have to investigate scenes and look for clues; I have to piece together any clues that I find. So most things that my character overcomes in the game is something that I've overcome as the player. Character resources are scarce so I have to manage those resources well or my character dies. That's fun. That's tension and drama. Things like light and darkness actually matter, so we have to manage those resources well or bad things happen to the characters.

To jump to other games for a moment. It's like the difference between Diplomacy and Risk. Both are great games but they have fundamentally different styles of play despite roughly similar goals. Conquer the world. In Risk you move pieces, roll dice, and take over lands. In Diplomacy you move pieces, personally negotiate with the other players, and take over lands.

Like with OSR play, that personal touch of me as the player doing things is far more engaging and rewarding than throwing dice.

As a referee, they're mostly all rules light and the play culture and expectations are more in line with how I run games. I'm not interested in thumping rule books and stopping play to look things up. Rulings, not rules. I am more interested in verisimilitude and things being (mostly) more logical, like just characters straight up dying from certain things rather than taking a few hit points damage. Play worlds, not rules. The players expect house rules and accept most without batting an eye. Home brewing, the DIY aesthetic, and getting weird with settings, monsters, characters, magic items is absolutely my jam. While those things do, sort of, exist outside the OSR, they're the beating heart of the OSR.

I started in 1984 with B/X. My oldest brother had a group playing AD&D. He is a collector so already had whatever BECMI boxes were out. But Basic D&D was seen as the kid's table game and B/X was the older and therefore "worse" version, so I was allowed to read that. Needless to say I was and still am absolutely hooked.

My current favorite OSR or adjacent games & books are: Acid Death Fantasy, Black Sword Hack, Cairn, DCC RPG, Five Torches Deep, Monster Overhaul, Old-School Essentials, Pirate Borg, Troika, and Ultraviolet Grasslands.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
I would agree that for me 5e obviates some of the need for player skill, partly through mechanics and partly through the play style evident even in adventures like the Lost Mines of Phandelver. Mechanics such as cantrips are extremely powerful relative to what OS characters can do, and come at no cost. Characters quickly acquire an array of special abilities that can help them navigate exploration and combat challenges. Meanwhile, there is a strong expectation that encounters will be balanced and appropriate to level.

That's just me though. I'm sure plenty of people play 5e in a more old school way and manage somehow
Exactly. Most of what I like about old-school play is just gone in 5E. What little remains is a hint of a shadow of its former self.
 


Oligopsony

Explorer
People played TSR D&D a lot of different ways back in the day, some of which were quite OSRy some of which weren’t. (The name, in this sense, is a misnomer, but it’s the name we’ve got.)

The most dissatisfactory thing about 5e by far is that character creation (especially above low levels) is an involved process, which discourages lethality. Fastcharacter is the best way to deal with this. Spellcasters also have a bunch of “this part of the game goes away” buttons, but TSR editions also had that.

Most other issues are not that hard to solve, if you’re the GM. Instead you want to be really clear about balance and play expectations (combat as war rather than sport), use diegetic engagement in lieu of skill checks, telegraph danger, import hazard dice, don’t fudge, use morale and reaction roles, etc.

I’d rather use OSE or Cairn in a vacuum, but 5e is passable, definitely moreso than 3.x or 4. It’s too crunchy overall but then so is AD&D.
 

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