WotC puts a stop to online sales of PDFs

[Breschau of Livonia]

I'm kinda confused. I mean I get going after pirates and all. But the hardcopy books have also shown up on filesharing sites. Meanwhile, I've made tons of WotC and TSR purchases on RPGnow without illegally sharing any. So because of crooks I can't purchase any more. To quote my favorite line to use on a car dealer - "Why won't you let me buy this car today?"

 

[Filcher]

Do you not understand business??

My suspicion is that contracts are more nuanced than you are suggesting:

If Wizards gives RPGNow the right to sell it's PDFs, people purchase them then they get taken away by Wizards, then thats Wizards wrong doing.

No. Everyone that bought a PDF could have downloaded it. We're angry because we won't be able to downloaded it the other 4 times, as promised by RPGnow.

I haven't seen the contract that RPGnow made with Wizards. I'll make that case that you haven't either. But I gave my money to RPGnow, who can't supply what they promised: 5 downloads of my PDF.

 

[Cadfan]

From what I can tell, WOTC just pulled the plug, which is likely a breach of contract on their part.

Contracts do not work that way.

Electronic media does not work that way.

Think it through.

I write a song, which will be sold exclusively through your online music retailer in mp3 form. I give you a copy of the mp3, and you allow people who pay you money to download that mp3. Then we split the money.

Lets say that our contract requires 30 days notice before cancellation.

How can I "pull the plug?" Lets say I order you to stop selling the mp3, and I don't give you 30 days notice. What do my words accomplish? You still have the mp3, and the right to sell it. What can I do? Its not like the data is piped from my master server to your customer. I can't turn it off like water from a faucet. I can't sue you either since you have a valid contract. My words are just talk.

One of the following scenarios happened.

1. WOTC didn't have a 30 day notice clause for terminating the license. They had a much shorter period, maybe even 24 hours, which they followed. I suspect this one as most likely.
2. WOTC did have a 30 day notice clause, and offered RPGNOW and the other retailers a new, more lucrative contract in the future if they agreed to cancel this contract now. RPGNOW decided that breaching their contracts with their customers was the better choice, terminated their current contract, and accepted the new one.
3. WOTC did have a 30 day notice clause, and gave notice 30 days ago. No one told the customers until today.

And I suppose, for the sake of argument, we can include:

4. No one at WOTC, Paizo, or RPGNOW has any clue what their licensing agreement says.

 

[Alzrius]

It seems clear to me that whoever is in charge of WotC right now is in fact a secret fan of Pathfinder. Why else would WotC be handing down such ridiculous decisions? Clearly, there's a secret superhero for Paizo pulling the strings. Nothing else makes any kind of sense.

That said, I echo the words of Piratecat:

What I find most annoying about this is that the honest people are being punished, and it's not going to slow down the dishonest people one bit.

Yeah, that pretty well sums it up.

 

[Filcher]

Contracts do not work that way.

Electronic media does not work that way.

Think it through.

I write a song, which will be sold exclusively through your online music retailer in mp3 form. I give you a copy of the mp3, and you allow people who pay you money to download that mp3. Then we split the money.

Lets say that our contract requires 30 days notice before cancellation.

How can I "pull the plug?" Lets say I order you to stop selling the mp3, and I don't give you 30 days notice. What do my words accomplish? You still have the mp3, and the right to sell it. What can I do? Its not like the data is piped from my master server to your customer. I can't turn it off like water from a faucet. I can't sue you either since you have a valid contract. My words are just talk.

One of the following scenarios happened.

1. WOTC didn't have a 30 day notice clause for terminating the license. They had a much shorter period, maybe even 24 hours, which they followed. I suspect this one as most likely.
2. WOTC did have a 30 day notice clause, and offered RPGNOW and the other retailers a new, more lucrative contract in the future if they agreed to cancel this contract now. RPGNOW decided that breaching their contracts with their customers was the better choice, terminated their current contract, and accepted the new one.
3. WOTC did have a 30 day notice clause, and gave notice 30 days ago. No one told the customers until today.

And I suppose, for the sake of argument, we can include:

4. No one at WOTC, Paizo, or RPGNOW has any clue what their licensing agreement says.

I agree with the man with 3000 more posts than I have. Experience points for all!

 

[joethelawyer]

Chris Pramas just posted this on his Facebook status section...

Green Ronin values and appreciates our PDF customers and to show it we've put True20 on sale for only $9.99. RPGNow.com - Green Ronin - True20 Adventure Roleplaying, Revised Edition


I love it!

 

[Beginning of the End]

One of the following scenarios happened.

1. WOTC didn't have a 30 day notice clause for terminating the license. They had a much shorter period, maybe even 24 hours, which they followed. I suspect this one as most likely.
2. WOTC did have a 30 day notice clause, and offered RPGNOW and the other retailers a new, more lucrative contract in the future if they agreed to cancel this contract now. RPGNOW decided that breaching their contracts with their customers was the better choice, terminated their current contract, and accepted the new one.
3. WOTC did have a 30 day notice clause, and gave notice 30 days ago. No one told the customers until today.

And I suppose, for the sake of argument, we can include:

4. No one at WOTC, Paizo, or RPGNOW has any clue what their licensing agreement says.

5. "Pull it down or we're going to sue you." "Can we afford to be sued by a major corporation? No? Okay, we're pulling it down."

 

[Treebore]

I think WOTC has forgotten that business, even big ones, survive on customer satisfaction. I think they will get reminded of this basic fact soon.

 

[Filcher]

Contracts do not work that way.

Electronic media does not work that way.

Think it through.

I write a song, which will be sold exclusively through your online music retailer in mp3 form. I give you a copy of the mp3, and you allow people who pay you money to download that mp3. Then we split the money.

Lets say that our contract requires 30 days notice before cancellation.

How can I "pull the plug?" Lets say I order you to stop selling the mp3, and I don't give you 30 days notice. What do my words accomplish? You still have the mp3, and the right to sell it. What can I do? Its not like the data is piped from my master server to your customer. I can't turn it off like water from a faucet. I can't sue you either since you have a valid contract. My words are just talk.

One of the following scenarios happened.

1. WOTC didn't have a 30 day notice clause for terminating the license. They had a much shorter period, maybe even 24 hours, which they followed. I suspect this one as most likely.
2. WOTC did have a 30 day notice clause, and offered RPGNOW and the other retailers a new, more lucrative contract in the future if they agreed to cancel this contract now. RPGNOW decided that breaching their contracts with their customers was the better choice, terminated their current contract, and accepted the new one.
3. WOTC did have a 30 day notice clause, and gave notice 30 days ago. No one told the customers until today.

And I suppose, for the sake of argument, we can include:

4. No one at WOTC, Paizo, or RPGNOW has any clue what their licensing agreement says.

I agree with the man with 3000 more posts than I have. Experience points for all!

 

[dmccoy1693]

My final thoughts on this topic:

I financial analyst once told me that if I want to know the health of a company today, I should look at its financial records, but if I wanted to know the health of the company tomorrow, I should look at its customer service. "Because you can only p*** off your customers for so long before they go elsewhere." (Yes, that is an exact quote.)

Two years ago this month, Wizards made their first major step in failing to act like an industry leader by cancelling the Dungeon and Dragon Magazines and failing to inform the public themselves. They allowed Paizo to deliver the official announcement while they remained silent. They were unable to own up to their own actions for a solid week when they finally caved and continued the mags as electronic only publications.

Today, in my opinion, they have taken their last act as an industry leader. Their actions over the past two years have become increasingly inexplicible. No longer can I, or anyone else I fear, look to Wizards for leadership or the new direction that role playing should go. No longer can Wizards claim to be on the cutting edge of the way products should be produced. No longer is Wizards the gold standard of the industry. Others will rise up to claim their place. May they learn what not to do.

Good-bye Wizards. May your Coast be peaceful and tranquil. I shall not visit you there.