WotC: "Why We Aren’t Funny"

Jesse Decker (editor-in-chief Dragon Magazine) and David Noonan (who is now part of Sasquatch Game Studios - if that name rings a bell, it's because I've been talking about their Primeval Thule setting a bit recently) wrote an article back in 2005 about humour in Dungeons & Dragons - or rather, the lack of it. It's especially relevant right now, with the whimsical NPCs found in the upcoming Out of the Abyss adventure for 5E, so I figured I'd resurrect it. As they said at the time, "Humor is pretty rare in D&D products these days—or at least intentional humor. We play it straight in our rulebooks, but many people play D&D as a series of running gags. So why are D&D books so serious when the game can get so goofy?"

Jesse Decker (editor-in-chief Dragon Magazine) and David Noonan (who is now part of Sasquatch Game Studios - if that name rings a bell, it's because I've been talking about their Primeval Thule setting a bit recently) wrote an article back in 2005 about humour in Dungeons & Dragons - or rather, the lack of it. It's especially relevant right now, with the whimsical NPCs found in the upcoming Out of the Abyss adventure for 5E, so I figured I'd resurrect it. As they said at the time, "Humor is pretty rare in D&D products these days—or at least intentional humor. We play it straight in our rulebooks, but many people play D&D as a series of running gags. So why are D&D books so serious when the game can get so goofy?"

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Obviously that's not the current stance, but it's an interesting look at the past. As the article goes on to say, "it wasn't always this way. The earliest editions of D&D are full of oddball monsters, bad puns, inside jokes, and encounters designed not to challenge the PCs but to amuse or embarrass them."

Anyway, here's the article. I've already asked in another post what you think of whimsy in your grimdark, so head here to vote in that poll.
 

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"Suffice it to say that there's a strangely numbered table in the Dungeon Master's Guide and some unusual alphabetizing in the Expanded Psionics Handbook."

Does anyone have an idea of what he was talking about?
 

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Rabulias

the Incomparably Shrewd and Clever
"...some unusual alphabetizing in the Expanded Psionics Handbook."

Does anyone have an idea of what he was talking about?

I think this refers to the Deja Vu power in the Expanded Psionics Handbook appearing twice in the book. :D

Not sure about the DMG reference.
 

Always remember "staff infection" and "whipping out the wand" jokes. :)

Or the Cleric doing the scene from a move, I forget the movie, where the character goes to get a shot to get rid of an STD and the doc tells him to drop his pant and starts heats a long metal rod and says something like "you got it the old fashion way, we cure it the old fashion way..."
"Jack... You seem to be experiencing some kind of theistic hysteria."
"How would you treat that?"
"Well the medieval remedy was to flay the skin off with brands of fire. I've no idea what the current thinking is..."
- Innerspace
 

Dire Bare

Legend
I'm sure WotC's "official" position on humor in D&D game books has shifted over the years, but not much really. There's a difference between "humor" and "whimsy". Avoiding puns, joke names, and other rampant silliness in official products is what I think the OP article was saying WotC tried to avoid at the time. And, it's probably mostly the same now. But loading a game adventure with whimsical and offbeat, or "fun" characters is a very different thing, IMO. I largely agree with the old 2005 Decker and Noonan stance, and I'm also very excited for "Out of the Abyss".
 

pemerton

Legend
D&D is easy, social fun. I am not here to prove that my character build is the uberest by taking down your enemy in an empty 20-by-20 battlefield. I am not here to listen quietly to everyone's detailed backstory. Degenerating into laughter for 5 minutes sounds like a great use of game-time to me. If that doesn't sound like a great time to you, I don't think we're using D&D for the same purposes. And honestly, I think you could be doing other things that realize your goals much better than D&D ever will - D&D cannot provide a balanced challenge like a competitive sport. D&D cannot entertain a broad audience like a written novel.
This is incredibly judgmental: people who approach D&D differently from you are doing so for puerile, boring reasons (taking down enemies on empty 20x20 battlefields, or making others listen quietly to their backstories, or proving that the character builds are the best in a balanced, sport-like challenge); and they are using the wrong medium for their boring goals, so not only are they boring and/or puerile, but they're idiots as well!

Last night I went to a theatre to see some stand-up comedy. The last time I went to the theatre it was to see Waiting for Godot. Last night I laughed. Waiting for Godot left me devastated and crying. I have some friends who would only go to the comedy, but not the absurdist tragedy. And of course some people experience Waiting for Godot as more comedic than tragic.

When I play D&D (or other fantasy RPGs) I am not generally aiming for laughs. When I need a quick, violent henchman in my Burning Wheel game last year, I brought Athog onto the stage. This got a wry smile from a couple of players (being a variant on "Thug A") - I wasn't looking for and don't need belly laughs.

In my BW game last week, the PCs were trudging through the Bright Desert into the foothills of the Abor-Alz. The orienteering check was failed, and I described them as having arrived in the foothills but east of where they wanted to be; and also described the pool they had found in a cleft in the foothill rocks as having been fouled by defecation. That could have been the trigger for a joke; moreso when a tracking check implied that the footprints around the pool were the light footprints of an elf. But the players played it completely straight, and were outraged and disgusted that anyone, let alone an elf, might do such a thing.

These legitimate ranges of aesthetic response to ingame situations have nothing to do with "uberbuilds", "empty battlefields", or "let me tell you my character's backstory".

I've GMed The Glacial Rift of the Frost Giant Jarl. I've also GMed Dungeonland. The latter has more (so-called) whimsy. The former is the better module, and can produce plenty of humour in play, mostly because of the tremendous amounts of both vertical and horizontal space in the rift. Dungeonland I found pretty boring and a bit of a hack-fest.

that's not at all what the cartoons in the rulebooks, the weird suggestions for tricks, or the funny art you might see by Jim Holloway in a module are about. They aren't making a humorous adventure full of jokes that may fall flat when actually played. They're absurdist takes on more serious situations common in games. The adventurers with the mouse disguises are clearly trying to infiltrate a mousey version of the temple on the cover of the 1e PH. It's the game company making a joke about its own product. Jim Holloway art often showed characters humorously failing or suffering consequences of accidents due to situations described seriously in the adventure. In all of these cases, you had the company embracing the idea that players will find humor in these situations even when originally presented in a serious manner
This is insightful.

The humour of Gygax's DMG isn't about trying to enforce one particular sort of experience on D&D players - it's presenting one particular aesthetic response to the sorts of situations that fantasy RPGing serves up.

Dungeonland, in my view, does fall flat. Whereas having the PC who is famous, at the table, for being the one who falls down the pits etc get pushed to the bottom of the Glacial Rift never gets old! (And I'm sure there are other groups who have played G2 and had humour be generated by fireballs melting the ice caves, or had a PC impaled by a bolt from the giants' ballistas, or whatever, though these things have never happened at my table.)

I think WotC's decision to remove humor, idiosyncrasy, and, ahem, any identifiable traces of voice from the official books was disastrous.
There are a lot of ways to avoid po-faced writing other than by writing "funny" adventures, though. Burning Wheel presents itself as a pretty serious game, but has more authorial voice in its rulebooks than any other RPG book I know except perhaps Gygax's DMG. (BW also has humour scattered throughout its character build rules, like the healing talent called Wolverine and the Leper lifepath giving the "White Gold Wielder" trait, but I'm not sure these add very much to the game.)

And while I can't comment on a wide range of 3E books, the 4e books don't strike me as any more "textbook" like than the RQ and RM rulebooks that were written 20 to 30 years before them. And while Tunnels and Trolls 5th ed (1979, I think), in contrast with these rulebooks, has a lot of voice and humour, I'm still more likely to play RM, RQ or 4e than T&T.
 


I'm A Banana

Potassium-Rich
This is incredibly judgmental: people who approach D&D differently from you are doing so for puerile, boring reasons (taking down enemies on empty 20x20 battlefields, or making others listen quietly to their backstories, or proving that the character builds are the best in a balanced, sport-like challenge); and they are using the wrong medium for their boring goals, so not only are they boring and/or puerile, but they're idiots as well!

"Incredibly Judgmental" of hypothetical individuals? Don't you imagine that's....at least a little hyperbolic?

More prosaically, it was meant to indicate a difference of play agenda. "Easy" fun vs. "Hard" fun (like overcoming a "a climatic encounter full of action, suspense, and danger"), and "Social" fun vs. "Sharing" fun (like a player who "is impatiently waiting for actual play to resume so his character can act out his story of vengeance" might want). D&D has left the days of hard fun (like killer dungeons) mostly in the past, and has never been a great venue for pure sharing fun (see, for instance, the archetypal railroad DM who has a story you're going along with like it or not), so it's not exactly controversial to state that D&D might not be the best venue for those seeking those experiences.

Someone seeking the most challenging fun they can get out of D&D would absolutely love going head-to-head with a monster in a featureless room, simply ability vs. ability, skill vs. skill, monster vs. PC in a knock-down drag-out assault. That would show skill and mastery and intelligence. There's nothing puerile or boring about that, but D&D might not be the best place to do that in. A DM in such a mode would totally have a problem with the joking - they just out-of-the-boxed this whole challenge! That's not the test of skill, it's just circumventing it!

But D&D in general has no problem with clever players circumventing challenges - it's not a game of skill mastery, it's a game of role-playing, of inhabiting a character's mindset and doing what they would do. That aspect makes it a bad fit in general for people who want to optimize this kind of fun in D&D.

Someone seeking the most creative fun they can get out of D&D would be delighted if everyone got on board with his personal character's mission and referenced elements of his character's history and actions to this point and felt the same sense of worry and urgency that his character was feeling at that time. That's compelling, there's nothing purile or boring about that either! And a player in such a mode would absolutely tone-police a funny incident like a plumetting golem as "not what the scene is really about."

But D&D in general has no problem with breaking character and laughing at a joke outside the context of the game world. It's a social game where friends come together to enjoy each other's company in the moment. That aspect makes it a bad fit in general for achieving a consistent and sustained and meaningful emotional resonance with the plight of the fictional characters at all times. It's why horror (and humor) games struggle. That aspect also makes it a bad fit in general for people who want to optimize this kind of fun in D&D.

D&D's also flexible, so you could probably make it more challenge-based or more sharing-based, and it's not like those elements don't crop up, but in a fundamental sense, it's not a game about either of those things. Lean too hard into those elements and you'll find some of the game assumptions breaking down.

These legitimate ranges of aesthetic response to ingame situations have nothing to do with "uberbuilds", "empty battlefields", or "let me tell you my character's backstory".

But the emotional goals served by D&D are, IMXP, better suited to a social delight rather than to challenge or personal creativity. It's why tables have discussions about how PC death will be handled and why a character that hurts the social dynamic (such as by stealing from other PCs) is toxic, no matter how well-justified and resonant their motivation for that action is.
 

pemerton

Legend
D&D has left the days of hard fun (like killer dungeons) mostly in the past, and has never been a great venue for pure sharing fun (see, for instance, the archetypal railroad DM who has a story you're going along with like it or not), so it's not exactly controversial to state that D&D might not be the best venue for those seeking those experiences.

<snip>

Someone seeking the most challenging fun they can get out of D&D would absolutely love going head-to-head with a monster in a featureless room

<snip>

Someone seeking the most creative fun they can get out of D&D would be delighted if everyone got on board with his personal character's mission and referenced elements of his character's history and actions to this point and felt the same sense of worry and urgency that his character was feeling at that time. That's compelling, there's nothing purile or boring about that either! And a player in such a mode would absolutely tone-police a funny incident like a plumetting golem as "not what the scene is really about."

But D&D in general has no problem with breaking character and laughing at a joke outside the context of the game world.

<snip>

But the emotional goals served by D&D are, IMXP, better suited to a social delight rather than to challenge or personal creativity. It's why tables have discussions about how PC death will be handled and why a character that hurts the social dynamic (such as by stealing from other PCs) is toxic, no matter how well-justified and resonant their motivation for that action is.
If this is meant to be truthful description, what is the evidence base? Because it doesn't really fit with my experience.

But in fact to me it just reads as more prescription, of your own prerefences over others.

On challenges and killer-dungeons: as far as I know the OSR is still a fairly big thing, and that deliberately harks back to classic D&D play, where the dungeon is the challenge.

On empty battlefield battles: I think that M:tG and WoW have mostly absorbed that part of the RPG market. But there are plenty of players who enjoy playing D&D as a challenge but regard dynamic battlefields and opportunity-exploitation as elements of the challenge. Disintegrating the bridge on which a golem is standing is one example of that sort of play.

And as someone who actually runs a game in which PC backstory is a principal driver for play, I hardly recognise your attempt to describe that sort of RPGing. Maybe all the creative players you know are po-faced fun police?

Classic D&D modules that I've used in d20 D&D games are Night's Dark Terror, G2, D2 and Castle Amber. Only one of those is particularly whimsical, and it didn't give the best play experience of those four modules. And that's not because I was "misusoing" D&D or misunderstood what it's good for.
 

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