Would you buy Epic Threats? (3pp)

[MatthewJHanson]

I was reading the epic tier Rule of Three thread, and started to wonder if Epic level material might benefit from some third party design.

So I got to thinking about a third party product that might contain a group thematically linked epic foes to challenge your PCs. For example a Demon Prince and his demon minions, or an Arch Fey and most powerful servants.

Before launching into such an endeavor, I thought I'd conduct a little non-scientific market research. Would you be interested in such a product? (If you choose it depends, please specify what it depends on.)

 

[JoeGKushner]

It depends.

Monsters aren't that hard for most people to come up with, especially with reskinning or using the DDI and 'slidding' things up and down.

It's one of the reasons why I said a boxed set on the thread you started this from.

A boxed set would give you locations, an adventure, new monsters, new magic items, new options, and hopefully the adventure would be good enough to tie it all together in one neat pacakage that made it worth utilizing even after the adventure was done, such as the old Caverns of Tharadizn where there were numerous new monsters and others bits in the adventure.

 

[Aegeri]

Whatever you do no demons. 4E is so full of demons at epic tier that it just isn't funny. You have 106 different demons from level 21 to 40 to choose from - including the greatest amount of level 30+ antagonists to choose from. Combining this with high level elementals and similar, you have enough to run a campaign forever.

If you love demons.

Now I love demons as much as the next DM, but if I was to ask myself "Do I want every campaign to HAVE to revolve around demons" the answer would be nooooo. So Archfey would be perfect - their is a distinct lack of them at epic tier and they have some interesting antagonists (like the excellent Bramble Queen for example). So some sinister epic level fey would be perfect.

Additionally avoid the trap of making everything elites and solos - there are billions of them already. Epic really needs rank and file creatures that serve these things. You can't make encounters with constant elites and solos every single encounter or it gets monotonous.

 

[S'mon]

I'm interested in 3PP Epic, but I'm not a huge fan of the Feywild as an Epic tier threat, I think it fits better into Paragon. I'd like to see some imaginative Epic Tier adventures. I'd especially like lots of stats for Epic standard (not elite/solo) NPCs of the core races - especially Humans; Elves Dwarves etc also good, but I really like using lots of Human foes and there's not nearly enough such statted currently. Human Epic minions would be good as well as well-designed Epic knights, slayers, mages etc. My core game world has the Mabden human invaders (from Moorcock's Corum/Swords saga) who are an Epic level threat at the top level. I'd like support for using them in 4e. Likewise the Viridians in Judges' Guild Wilderlands, though they could be done high-Paragon.

Did I say I like humans?

Edit: I guess my ideal supplement would be 'The Big Ole Book of Humans' with dozens of interesting human foes at each of Heroic, Paragon and Epic tiers. Both generics and some sample individual humans, like Orcus and Doresain in MM1. These individuals could be Elites if appropriate, but 80%+ of the stats should be standards & minions.

 

[Matt James]

I have something planned that I feel each of you will find of value. Depending on my other gigs that come up, I am aiming for a pre-Gen Con release--but I can't say for sure.

 

[MatthewJHanson]

Thanks for the responses.

Demons were not my first choice either, I was just using them as an example.

I think a true boxed set is beyond my capabilities at the moment. However I like the idea of creating a sort of "adventure tool box." In addition to the monster stats it could include description of their home, their history, adventure hooks (including at least one multi-level arc). Also new magic items, terrain, traps, and rituals that might be relevant.

 

[vodacce]

please no dungeon crawl. more roleplay please. i think that epic tier is very good for diplomacy and war. I don't want another dungeon with demons.

Sorry for my bad english

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

It is hard to know exactly what to recommend. More monsters, traps, puzzles, terrain are all useful. Artifact ideas would be nice too. Some rundowns on possible themes would be good. I'd be good with a few locations, some example encounters, some detailed ideas on monster design.

I have to agree with people in the other thread that pointed out how hard it is to create generic epic adventures though, given the degree that things have to match with the character's personal story, close integration with the themes of the setting, etc.