Gandalf

There is a standing tradition of building the characters from the Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings in D&D. And I probably dont need to describe him that much ;p

Gandalf is supposed to be the primary inspiration for the Invoker class - but it looks like to get the feel for him.. an Avenger/Invoker might better do the trick (I dont picture him hiding chain under those robes - but Armor of Faith)....
In the past I have argued Gandalf seemed to bring in some Paladin-hood but that was as much the bonded mount feature (which Paladins no longer push and the dabbling of Leader healer elements certainly which are emphasized in the character and the heavy knowledge feature could be bard like (the creation of his world is described as being a song so this emphasis is not bad)?

So maybe he isnt quite so nailed down?

Does anybody not think Deva is a solid racial archetype? for this reincarnating Maiar hero

Wonder what power level to build him at say ---
Paragon (Gandalf the Grey) / Epic (Gandalf the White)

The threads I have seen were earlier in D&D 4e's development cycle and really didnt seem to capture him that well.

for example
D&D 4e challenge: stat out the Fellowship of the Ring! - RPGnet Forums
http://www.enworld.org/forum/d-d-4th-edition-rules/235882-multiclassing-gandalf.html

Nyeh...nothing even worth mining.

I'd say:

- Race: Deva
- Class: Invoker
- Armor: Cloth
- Weapon: Longsword
- Implement: Staff

So where exactly did your pure invoker pick up longsword proficiency..
and I wonder what his strength is with it in battle ;p

Gandalf the Grey, level 11
Deva, Avenger|Invoker, Flame of Hope
Hybrid Avenger: Hybrid Avenger Reflex
Covenant Manifestation: Manifestation of Preservation
Hybrid Invoker: Hybrid Invoker Fortitude
Hybrid Talent: Armor of Faith
Background: Elfharrow (Elfharrow Benefit)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 11, Con 14, Dex 12, Int 18, Wis 21, Cha 14.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 13, Dex 10, Int 14, Wis 16, Cha 13.


AC: 25 Fort: 22 Reflex: 22 Will: 23
HP: 76 Surges: 8 Surge Value: 19

TRAINED SKILLS
Perception +15, Nature +16, Insight +15, Arcana +14

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +6, Bluff +7, Diplomacy +7, Dungeoneering +10, Endurance +7, Heal +10, History +11, Intimidate +7, Religion +11, Stealth +8, Streetwise +7, Thievery +6, Athletics +6

FEATS
Learned Spellcaster: Ritual Caster
Level 1: Learned Spellcaster
Level 2: Weapon Proficiency (Bastard sword)
Level 4: Battle Intuition
Level 6: Hybrid Talent
Level 8: Heavenly Heritage
Level 10: Mark of Handling
Level 11: Great Fortitude

POWERS
Hybrid Avenger at-will 1: Bond of Pursuit
Hybrid Invoker at-will 1: Divine Bolts
Hybrid encounter 1: Whirlwind Charge
Hybrid daily 1: Purging Flame
Hybrid utility 2: Loyal Sanction
Hybrid encounter 3: Symbol of the Broken Sword
Hybrid daily 5: Dance of Flame
Hybrid utility 6: Shield of Light
Hybrid encounter 7: Avenging Winds
Hybrid daily 9: Winds of Woe
Hybrid utility 10: Divine Renewal

ITEMS
Adventurer's Kit, Holy Symbol, Ring of Fireblazing (paragon tier), Battle Staff +2, Elven Cloak +2, Enduring Spirit Vestments Githweave Armor +3, Dread Bastard sword +3, Rare Herbs (Nature), Spellbook, , Celestial Charger
RITUALS
Hand of Fate, Animal Messenger, Gentle Repose, Explorer's Fire, Call Wilderness Guide, Speak with Nature, Magic Circle, Animal Friendship, Sending, Wizard's Sight, Drawmij's Instant Summons

Well,

in my oppinion when we make a book/movie based build we must observe the context.

In the LotR movies Gandalf and other spell casters spells were more like rituals casters tham actual casters.Considering this (believe or not) its a low magic campaign (at least visually).

I see 2 paths to choose from:

1) Like suggested by Klaus he could be a Invoker or Wizard, with high inteligence, wisdom and charisma.
The longsword would be just a speciall effect since - lets face it - invokers dont need swords to fight orcs.
You would keep the roleplay of gandalf and his flavor, but not combat style. A couple of feats like Weapon Profciency and melee training would sufice.

2) If you want to have a closer to his fighting style approach, with powers that actually are chanelled "via" sword, you would have to either multiclass or create a class for him.
I think mixing Avenger or Spellsword would solve the problem, but in my oppinion Gandalf looks and/or attitude would not be the same.


Lets face it: Gandalf from movies dont use Magic Missiles or Divine Bolts becuse Tolkien came before DnD, not the other way around.

Just 2 cents.

Dr_Sage said:

Lets face it: Gandalf from movies dont use Magic Missiles or Divine Bolts becuse Tolkien came before DnD, not the other way around.

Click to expand...

Gandalf killed Orcs with lightening in the hobbit so I have no problems with it. And he burn a balrog one on one and upclose in the LOTR..He weilded a magic sword.
Hybrid Avenger/Invoker gives me a melee weapon at will and lightning flashes from his invoker... its pretty win/win.

A low fantasy interpretation of Gandalf? Nyeh.

Garthanos said:

Gandalf killed Orcs with lightening in the hobbit so I have no problems with it. And he burn a balrog one on one and upclose in the LOTR..He weilded a magic sword.
Hybrid Avenger/Invoker gives me a melee weapon at will and lightning flashes from his invoker... its pretty win/win.

A low fantasy interpretation of Gandalf? Nyeh.

Click to expand...

You have to ask yourself, why he havent used lightining bolts on the hundreds of orc/goblins/uruks he found later?

I am happy to imagine that Tolkien had reconsidered it. Dont expect someone who is able to toss bolts of lightining at will to use a sword... again just my oppinion.

Dr_Sage said:

You have to ask yourself, why he havent used lightining bolts on the hundreds of orc/goblins/uruks he found later?

I am happy to imagine that Tolkien had reconsidered it. Dont expect someone who is able to toss bolts of lightining at will to use a sword... again just my oppinion.

Click to expand...

The explanation in the books was... that he didnt want the Big bad to pin point and home in on him. (awakening ring... awakening evil and all that). The literary reason is so the other characters could shine a little more.

Avenger ultimately precise sword blows are tolerable right alongside the more eratic bolts.

Gandalfs I will take out the Balrog everyone else escape could be an avenger isolation in action ;-).

Here's my take at Gandalf Grayhame, Stormcrow:

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Grayhame, level 11
Deva, Invoker, Flame of Hope <--- Doesn't mean to be great, but to inspire greatness
Divine Covenant: Covenant of Preservation
Background: Birth - Blessed (+2 to Insight)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 11, Con 15, Dex 11, Int 17, Wis 22, Cha 12.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 10, Con 12, Dex 10, Int 14, Wis 17, Cha 11.


AC: 21 Fort: 18 Reflex: 19 Will: 23
HP: 65 Surges: 8 Surge Value: 16

TRAINED SKILLS
Religion +15, History +15, Arcana +13, Insight +18

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +5, Bluff +6, Diplomacy +6, Dungeoneering +11, Endurance +9, Heal +11, Intimidate +6, Nature +11, Perception +11, Stealth +5, Streetwise +6, Thievery +5, Athletics +5

FEATS
Invoker: Ritual Caster
Level 1: Auspicious Lineage
Level 2: Battle Intuition <--- Wisdom for initiative
Level 4: Scourge of the Fallen <--- Racial power adds to atk and damage vs. immortals
Level 6: Melee Training (Wisdom)
Level 8: Weapon Proficiency (Bastard sword)
Level 10: Heavenly Heritage <--- gains temporary hp from fire damage (Balrog fight!)
Level 11: Remembered Mother Tongue <--- can speak with anything that has a language

POWERS
Invoker at-will 1: Vanguard's Lightning
Invoker at-will 1: Sun Strike <--- Protecting the retreat of Faramir
Invoker encounter 1: Astral Terror <---- BILLLLBO BAGGINNNNSSS!
Invoker daily 1: Purging Flame <---- against the Witch King on Minas Tirith
Invoker utility 2: Perfect Recall
Invoker encounter 3: Symbol of the Broken Sword <--- useful vs. Balrog
Invoker daily 5: Searing Orb
Invoker utility 6: Theologian's Shield
Invoker encounter 7: Trumpets of Celestia <--- The Two Towers, during the Charge of the Rohirim
Invoker daily 9: Twist of Fate
Invoker utility 10: Insightful Comment

ITEMS
Ritual Book, Indomitable Resolve Vestments Githweave Armor +3, Ravenclaw Warblade Bastard sword +2 (if drop non-minion to 0hp, can spend healing surge), Moonsilver Staff +3, Ring of Invigoration (paragon tier -- when at 0hp, spend healing surge)
RITUALS
Hand of Fate, Animal Messenger, Gentle Repose, Explorer's Fire, Call Wilderness Guide, Speak with Nature, Magic Circle, Animal Friendship, Sending, Wizard's Sight, Drawmij's Instant Summons
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======

All in all, this version has incredible resiliency (representing the divine nature of Gandalf), and is good in fights against foes like the Ringwraiths, the Balrog and Saruman. The Paragon Path fits Gandalf's style, and the rituals and powers have a more subtle nature.

Oh by the way in real life due in part due to modern healing practices only 20 percent of lightning hits are fatal... ummm dont ask me where I got that tid bit. When I heard it though it got me thinking that wizards could be using lightning without totally over shadowing everyone else... damn that proves I am a geek.

Garthanos said:

The explanation in the books was... that he didnt want the Big bad to pin point and home in on him. (awakening ring... awakening evil and all that). The literary reason is so the other characters could shine a little more.

Avenger ultimately precise sword blows are tolerable right alongside the more eratic bolts.

Gandalfs I will take out the Balrog everyone else escape could be an avenger isolation in action ;-).

Click to expand...

That's why I gave Gandalf a sword that has a reason to be used. As Glamdring (Foe Hammer), it keeps the wielder fighting against wave upon wave of enemies. And its healing properties are a reason for Gandalf to wield it.