Star Wars Saga: The Dawn of Defiance [OOC Thread]
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Binder Fred
3 rings to bind them all!
Discussion? Didn't we do that IC?
I voted for Kidnap myself.
I voted for Kidnap myself.
Binder Fred
3 rings to bind them all!
Two for Kidnap! (On an OOC note, whatever we think about our odds of success, this course has a pretty low chance of being boring 
). Perrin, you're up!
). Perrin, you're up!
perrinmiller
Adventurer
I think Mack originally suggested the kidnapping, IIRC. So he is not adverse to it from an IC point of view.
Though, I sense a strong objection to the idea from SD. Not sure she would burn a FP to veto the course of action or not, but if I vote against the idea as a player we would be split. What then?
While it would be interesting and in many senses it is a choose your own adventure situation, so we could be digging our own grave as the saying goes.
I had thought that we brought up a point that kidnapping the Imp was going to undo the negotiations we worked on? That might not be important, perhaps.
Overall mission was fact finding. Accomplished, yeah?
Secondary mission, rescuing the carbonitecicles? Kidnapping the Imp doesn't further that goal. At least I am not seeing it accomplishing that goal yet.
Though, I sense a strong objection to the idea from SD. Not sure she would burn a FP to veto the course of action or not, but if I vote against the idea as a player we would be split. What then?
While it would be interesting and in many senses it is a choose your own adventure situation, so we could be digging our own grave as the saying goes.
I had thought that we brought up a point that kidnapping the Imp was going to undo the negotiations we worked on? That might not be important, perhaps.
Overall mission was fact finding. Accomplished, yeah?
Secondary mission, rescuing the carbonitecicles? Kidnapping the Imp doesn't further that goal. At least I am not seeing it accomplishing that goal yet.
Dr Simon
Explorer
perrinmiller said:
Well Darius for one couldn't give a pile of bantha poodoo if a deal between the Empire and a Hutt goes sour or not, and he'd tell you that in character!
perrinmiller said:
I think it would help with the fact-finding, also tie up a potential loose end that may blow our cover. Darius isn't in the market for torture or brutality himself, but he's morally compromised enough that he'd be happy to hand her over to others for a spot of "extraordinary rendition".
Songdragon
Explorer
PM does have the right of it for me... It is tempting to just have Mir get out and you three can go do what you want kidnapping and what not. (it would mean at best assaulting her escorts, at worst killing them as well. Considering they are clones, I do not see them going down without heavy interest.)
Mir could technically and quite likely Mind Trick everyone there... But then, that again is not how Mir would do things either... So the first option (Mir gets out you guys go do whatever you wish to do) seems the best for everyone concerned at this point. And I would have no hard feelings over you guys RPing things out on your end for however long you need to, either. I just do not like being forced along for the ride.
Just saying is all.
Mir could technically and quite likely Mind Trick everyone there... But then, that again is not how Mir would do things either... So the first option (Mir gets out you guys go do whatever you wish to do) seems the best for everyone concerned at this point. And I would have no hard feelings over you guys RPing things out on your end for however long you need to, either. I just do not like being forced along for the ride.
Just saying is all.
Binder Fred
3 rings to bind them all!
Strongly disagree, as stated before (and in this case I agree with myself
).To be honest, this is VERY low priority on Sloor's list (calling it an objective would be stretching it even). The only reason he even cares is because Mir wants it (for some unphantomable womany/humany reason
).It's actually the only thing that's bothering Sloor about the Kidnap plan, now that he's found a way around the murdery bits.
Well, we're going a bit in circles here, I think, the very thing the voting mechanism was designed to avoid. So, Perrin, please vote, either for Turn Back or Kidnap, or abstain I guess (the only options that will change anything at this point). Songdragon will then be free to decide if she wants to spend thast FP to change the vote to what she wants or go with what's below. "Strong objections" is exactly why this mechanism was built in, you know, so I say just vote for what *you* want and let's move on.
If you feel it's in character for Mir to leave them alone *specifically* because she thinks this is going to turn badly, then what can I say? Go for it. Sloor was going to offer to drop her off anyways if it came to that (had the thing already written) -- while of course actually strongly hoping she wouldn't take him up on it.
perrinmiller
Adventurer
I dislike schisms, but my IC post of holding off the decision to execute the kidnapping was my vote. Only smart to be cautious on feasibility before stepping into the drek.
Since I did not object, my vote is more like an abstention for OOC purposes. I am not able to convince you guys against it IC anyway, since Darius is in agreement. If Mack were to side with Mir on principle (trying to win points to get in her pants ) it would only split the decision and we get us nowhere. {shrugs}
Since I did not object, my vote is more like an abstention for OOC purposes. I am not able to convince you guys against it IC anyway, since Darius is in agreement. If Mack were to side with Mir on principle (trying to win points to get in her pants
) it would only split the decision and we get us nowhere. {shrugs}Binder Fred
3 rings to bind them all!
Maybe it would help Songdragon feel better about using that FP to swing the vote to Follow Only (which is how I interpret your vote)?
I don't know about Dr Simon (though I imagine he feels the same), but I would just like to specify that I am fully conscious that this is a game and I'm here to enjoy myself, i.e. my ego/self-worth/deep feelings are *not* deeply invested in this single decision. The FP mechanism has been put in place so that, if a player feels strongly enough about a course of action, then the strength of that feeling can be weighted against the (perhaps only lukewarm) preferences of the majority (who can then evaluate how strongly they feel about their own votes and decide whether or not to invest their own FP to reflect the strength of *their* conviction). i.e. it's a weighted average mechanism, nothing more. If you don't feel strongly enough about the matter to loose one more FP and (probably the bigger factor here, though I'm just guessing) risk the *possibility* of ruffling some feathers, then the system says your preference doesn't, in fact, outweight the preference of the majority. There's no need to make it any more complicated than that, or try to (counter-productively, IMHO) mind-read the other's possible reactions/degree of comitment beforehand. Let's just assume by default that we're all adults that remember they're playing a game and deal with any ruffled feelings if and when they arise.
That said, I *am* (strongly) invested in telling a good, realistic story, and that (strongly) requires all characters involved take actions that make in story sense. At this point, after all the IC arguments, if Songdragon uses that FP, it would make *no* sense for Sloor and Darius to just meekly change their mind on a dime, so I think something would need to happen to make them realize the strength of Mir's objection. Let's use this disagreement, not as a hurdle to be overcome, but as an opportunity to say something about Mir as a person, as an opportunity to deepen our shared story (and what is said is of course ultimately up to SD, just brainstorming here).
Mir leaving might be one way, though I think it unlikely it would change their minds, and it's not something that I would have thought would be IC for Mir (though temper will tell, and she can always regret/try to correct/burry it deep/shrug it off afterwards, of course, which will all tell us something about her). I think we can all agree though that in a purely OOC way, putting *a player* on the sideline is a less than desirable outcome all around unless the downtime is specifically what's desired (i.e. OOC reasons affecting IC behavior rather than the reverse). Another way might be if Mir felt trapped between the danger she sees coming (for her, her teamates and their mission as a whole), her frustration at not being able to make them see it and, at the same time, her need to protect them from it, precluding her outright withdrawal from the situation? That could lead to a variety of actions on her part (Simmering Resentment being the less interresting and most destructive possiblity IMHO), but considering her powers are mind/influence based and that SD herself mentionned the temptation of it, for-their-own-good Power Abuse might be a realistic, gut-of-the-moment reaction to the situation. It doesn't even need to succeed (or she can immediatly reverse it if it does), but it would be one heck of a cold bath (for Sloor at least), to see that she's willing to go that far. *Now* changing course could make perfect IC sense... What do you guys think? Anything spark your imagination in there SD?
I don't know about Dr Simon (though I imagine he feels the same), but I would just like to specify that I am fully conscious that this is a game and I'm here to enjoy myself, i.e. my ego/self-worth/deep feelings are *not* deeply invested in this single decision. The FP mechanism has been put in place so that, if a player feels strongly enough about a course of action, then the strength of that feeling can be weighted against the (perhaps only lukewarm) preferences of the majority (who can then evaluate how strongly they feel about their own votes and decide whether or not to invest their own FP to reflect the strength of *their* conviction). i.e. it's a weighted average mechanism, nothing more. If you don't feel strongly enough about the matter to loose one more FP and (probably the bigger factor here, though I'm just guessing) risk the *possibility* of ruffling some feathers, then the system says your preference doesn't, in fact, outweight the preference of the majority. There's no need to make it any more complicated than that, or try to (counter-productively, IMHO) mind-read the other's possible reactions/degree of comitment beforehand. Let's just assume by default that we're all adults that remember they're playing a game and deal with any ruffled feelings if and when they arise.
That said, I *am* (strongly) invested in telling a good, realistic story, and that (strongly) requires all characters involved take actions that make in story sense. At this point, after all the IC arguments, if Songdragon uses that FP, it would make *no* sense for Sloor and Darius to just meekly change their mind on a dime, so I think something would need to happen to make them realize the strength of Mir's objection. Let's use this disagreement, not as a hurdle to be overcome, but as an opportunity to say something about Mir as a person, as an opportunity to deepen our shared story (and what is said is of course ultimately up to SD, just brainstorming here).
Mir leaving might be one way, though I think it unlikely it would change their minds, and it's not something that I would have thought would be IC for Mir (though temper will tell, and she can always regret/try to correct/burry it deep/shrug it off afterwards, of course, which will all tell us something about her). I think we can all agree though that in a purely OOC way, putting *a player* on the sideline is a less than desirable outcome all around unless the downtime is specifically what's desired (i.e. OOC reasons affecting IC behavior rather than the reverse). Another way might be if Mir felt trapped between the danger she sees coming (for her, her teamates and their mission as a whole), her frustration at not being able to make them see it and, at the same time, her need to protect them from it, precluding her outright withdrawal from the situation? That could lead to a variety of actions on her part (Simmering Resentment being the less interresting and most destructive possiblity IMHO), but considering her powers are mind/influence based and that SD herself mentionned the temptation of it, for-their-own-good Power Abuse might be a realistic, gut-of-the-moment reaction to the situation. It doesn't even need to succeed (or she can immediatly reverse it if it does), but it would be one heck of a cold bath (for Sloor at least), to see that she's willing to go that far. *Now* changing course could make perfect IC sense... What do you guys think? Anything spark your imagination in there SD?
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