So, who wants to talk about new Doctor Who (spoilers likely)

Herschel · Oct 8, 2012

I want to re-watch "Asylum of the Daleks" because there's a couple of nagging bits in it I want to reconcile.

1. I remember a bit where Oswin delivers a line and gives the camera a sly look, but I don't remember the line or the context.

2. There's also the bit about where she hacked in to their consciouness stream.

3. The line about removing Love and replacing it with Hate actually leads to it and "A Town Called Mercy" actually being in chronological order, if the Daleky-Waleky stuff has any import.

sabrinathecat · Oct 9, 2012

Does anyone remember that Capt Jack was a Time Agent, and his primary mode of travel was the arm bracelet? The ship was just something he happened to pick up.

And, if you want to step way outside the series, in the target novels written in the dark times of the mid 90s, The Doctor gives Bernice Summerfield and her husband their wedding rings, which allow them to travel in time.

Of course, River Song, as far as I'm concerned, was just a rip-off clone of Bernice Summerfield anyway...

Since taking over, Moffat has ruined Doctor Who. It is sad, because he was responsible for about 6 of the best episodes ever written. Now, it's a pathetic imitation of itself. I can only hope he retires soon, and turns the show over to someone who actually cares.

Herschel · Oct 9, 2012

"Rip-off clone of Bernice Summerfield"? Really? Have you ever actually seen/read/listened to them? That's just ridiculous. They're both profs at some point and that's about it.

sabrinathecat · Oct 9, 2012

Both time-traveling archeologists who have had intimate relations/sex with the doctor?
Yeah, nothing in common whatsoever.

Actually, you're right. There is one very major difference.
When I first ran into the character of Bernice, I found her very irritating and annoying, but she grew on me. I realize not that the problem was with the early scripts more than the character.
When I first ran into River, she was mildly interesting, and I was looking forward to finding out who she was. Now, I'm sick to death of her, and would like the character to simply disappear.

Remus Lupin · Oct 9, 2012

Well, this is clearly the thread to crap all over Stephen Moffat's contribution to the Dr. Who cannon. Honestly! Ruined? C'mon. We can all have our disagreements on what are and aren't strong episodes or what's happened with the Doctor during the Amy/Rory arc, but it's produced some of the best Who and most fun television in the past decade.

And, as importantly, I remember some of the abominations Russell T. Davies produced. The worst of Moffatt is light years better than RTD on a bad day.

sabrinathecat · Oct 9, 2012

RTD did some brilliant work. On the other hand, he also did some horrible work, especially toward the end, when he was obviously burned out. Like John-Nathan Turner, RTD was a better producer than ideas person--he knew how to get hype on his side. During RTD, Moffat wrote 6 excellent episodes.

Since taking over, well, Series 5 was so bad that after watching the show for 25 years I was ready to stop. Still, I gave it a chance, and series 6 was slightly better. Only slightly.

Under RTD, NuWho had a lot of soap-opera. Under Moffat, logic gets pushed aside for emotion and fairy-tale flavor, with River Song shoe-horned in whenever possible, whether she's needed or not.

But hey, that's just my arrogant opinion. Empty Child/Doctor Dances, Blink, and the Library 2-parter will probably remain the top stories of NuWho, and among the top of Doctor Who in general for a very long time.

But Greatest Show in the Galaxy in no longer the worst.

Remus Lupin · Oct 9, 2012

I will grant you that I could stand seeing precisely zero more of River song. Her story is pretty well played out.

Morrus · Oct 9, 2012

The worst of modern Who is RTD's Slitheen nonsense. Farting aliens running round Downing Street. I tried to get a friend into the show, and those episodes (unfortunately near the beginning) just made him vow never to watch the show.

Moffat is different to RTD, but he's never done anything that bad.

sabrinathecat · Oct 9, 2012

Yes, the Slitheen... The only thing worse than their initial concept was their being re-used so many times.

Moffat turned the Daleks into Danish Modern kitchenware. On the other hand, he got rid of the oh-so-tired "these are the last daleks in the universe...until next time we bring them back".

Unfortunately, the daleks will be used, in some capacity, at least once per series. That was the deal struck with Terry Nation's estate for them to be used.

Now, the crack in time arc--not only did it not make sense, but it was never resolved. And the final episode... Amy pats her younger self's hair. Think about that for a second. If you can't see the problem, then watch Father's Day and Mawdren Undead. If Amy has to remember things for them to come back, then only the places she remembers come back. If she didn't encounter it, it doesn't exist anymore. How much of the universe did she actually see? How could she remember River in order for River to show up at her wedding? On the other hand, if everything comes back, whether she remembers or not, which makes a lot more sense, what was the point of this whole thing? And the Cracks are still there. But it seems that the entire story line has been abandoned.

But I'm a cranky old guy. What do I know?

Morrus · Oct 9, 2012

sabrinathecat said:
Yes, the Slitheen... The only thing worse than their initial concept was their being re-used so many times.

Moffat turned the Daleks into Danish Modern kitchenware. On the other hand, he got rid of the oh-so-tired "these are the last daleks in the universe...until next time we bring them back".

Unfortunately, the daleks will be used, in some capacity, at least once per series. That was the deal struck with Terry Nation's estate for them to be used.

Now, the crack in time arc--not only did it not make sense, but it was never resolved. And the final episode... Amy pats her younger self's hair. Think about that for a second. If you can't see the problem, then watch Father's Day and Mawdren Undead. If Amy has to remember things for them to come back, then only the places she remembers come back. If she didn't encounter it, it doesn't exist anymore. How much of the universe did she actually see? How could she remember River in order for River to show up at her wedding? On the other hand, if everything comes back, whether she remembers or not, which makes a lot more sense, what was the point of this whole thing? And the Cracks are still there. But it seems that the entire story line has been abandoned.

But I'm a cranky old guy. What do I know?

Sure, I'll give you some logical inconsitency there; and then raise you magical fairy telekinetic glowing flying superpowered David Tennant when everybody says his name at the same time....