epithet
Explorer
You both made it. He just had it readied before initiative was rolled and you reacted to it.
I couldn't have reacted to it unless I was ready for it ahead of time.
D&D 5E Non-stealth surprise
I couldn't have reacted to it unless I was ready for it ahead of time.
epithet
Explorer
Eh, I disagree. But as long as you apply it consistently and your players don't have a problem with it, whether or not I like it is irrelevant.
(I will say that if I was one of your players and was aware that you allowed readied actions outside of combat, we'd all have "readied actions" to attack any enemies once the designated door opener (preferably the warlocks invisible Imp or a caster using an appropriate cantrip) opens the door for us.
Every single time. )
That's perfectly fine. You tell me what you're ready for (be specific), and if it happens before your turn you can use your reaction. If you know exactly what's on the other side of the door, then that should accrue to your advantage. Preparation is always rewarded... as long as you've prepared for what you actually encounter.
How specific? Usually it's just "I ready a [specific attack] for when I see an enemy."
If you are requiring more than that, then what are the hypothetical goblins specifying?
epithet
Explorer
That's fine, but you might be taking your shot vs. 3/4 cover or losing your readied attack. If you have the sharpshooter feat, no problem. Also, what's an enemy? Most cases are pretty obvious, but some aren't. Specific would be more like "if I get a clear shot at a cultist or an undead, I take it."
Most readied attacks are, in my experience, something like "I ready an arrow. When that little bastard pops his head back up, I'm gonna put a hole in it." I can totally work with that. Something like "I'm holding a ray of frost cantrip for anything that looks dangerous" is too vague, because it makes me want to ask you to roll a wisdom (perception) check to tell the difference between a (natural) shadow and the bugbear hiding in it. No one wants a "I cast magic missile at the darkness" scenario.
Edit: The hypothetical goblins are specifying, in all likelihood, launching an arrow at the first unfamiliar creature, with a weapon drawn or appearing to casting a spell, with half cover or less. If there is a boss in the room, most of them would be specifying firing on command. The boss will do something intelligence-appropriate.
Edit 2: I think the point of being specific is that, just like an attack of opportunity, when the condition is met you attack or you don't--that's the only decision you can make with a readied attack. All the other decisions were made ahead of time.
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Yeah, but we are talking a "open the door and readied actions go off" scenario. If you let the hypothetical goblins ready an attack, what are they specifying? "Shoot through the doorway when the door opens?" or "Shoot any non-goblin that opens the door?" Something else?
What happens if the door opens and no PC's are visible? What if they put a minor illusion of a person in the door way and open it from the side?
epithet
Explorer
If you put an illusion of a person in the doorway and open the door with a thaumaturgy cantrip, you get to laugh at the goblins' waste of ammunition. Good job.
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epithet
Explorer
From a DM perspective, letting the goblins ready an action works a lot like a trap. A player character triggers the trap, the trap goes off. Mechanically, traps only have reactions (unless they're complex traps that do something after their initial attack.) You don't have to be "in combat" or tracking initiative to set a trap.
Fair enough.
Arial Black
Adventurer
You don't need to break the 5E rules in order to adjudicate this scene in a sensible way; you can do that by following the rules.
In this case the rule in question is "the DM determines who is surprised". How the DM determines surprise is not a rule, although a suggestion is given for the most common D&D scenario: Stealth/Perception when encountering a creature you didn't know was there. This doesn't preclude scenarios where other methods would be more appropriate, such as when you do know a creature is there but you don't recognise it as a threat.
The DM rules that Mr. Armour Pants is surprised and that the goblins are not. The DM doesn't need to roll or ask for rolls. In this case the DM rules that the antics of Twinkle Toes have certainly alerted the goblins and the response of the goblins and the lack of care by Mr. Armour Pants takes away any uncertainty.
Since the idiot is surprised then he can't do anything on his turn, even if he wins initiative. The goblins can then shoot him on their first turns.
You don't need to break the combat rules in order to have the sensible result of the goblins shooting the idiot before the idiot can do anything.
And yes it is against the 5E rules to take the Ready Action In Combat...outside combat. First, Actions In Combat are neither allowed or required to 'do stuff' when you are not in initiative/combat rounds. Second, the Ready Action specifically affects the timing of events in the combat round, so the Ready Action has no function outside of combat rounds.
Arial Black
Adventurer
Good call. Attacking an object is not (usually) combat. You can make an attack roll with a weapon against something that isn't going to fight back outside combat and without using or requiring Actions In Combat.
Again, good call. Initiative order is a useful tool when the timing of various actors is crucial, and you may use combat rounds even if no-one is trying to kill anyone.
However, if someone is trying to kill someone who could possibly fight back/escape/whatever, then this is what the combat system is for! It would be shenanigans of the highest order to pretend that 'axing him in the head' is not combat, just so you could meta-game around his rightful immunity to surprise/valid Reactions/whatever else he could do if you were using initiative order properly.
The 'you' here is not 'you: Caliban' but 'you: whoever the DM is'.
