Ideas for Improving Inspiration

the Jester · Oct 23, 2018

I can't believe I forgot to mention this upthread in my earlier post.

I also award inspiration as a reward for things that don't earn xp.

See, to me, xp comes from activities that include danger. I prefer to reward social encounters, puzzles (but not traps- those I give ad hoc xps for) solved, or the like with inspiration, rather than xp; it's a tangible reward, yet maintains D&D's traditional dynamic of leveling up coming via dangerous activities. And I've also attached inspiration to other subsections of my game; for instance, a character who spends the time and resources to build or claim a stronghold that completes a long rest inside that stronghold gets inspiration.

Guest 6801328 · Oct 23, 2018

CapnZapp said:
True.

I'm maybe looking at this from the other side of the coin, where Inspiration short-circuits the regular mini-game of Advantage, but true nonetheless.

The solution, of course, is to divorce Inspiration from Advantage

Yet another reason why "after-the-fact Advantage" is a good houserule for Inspiration.

Guest 6801328 · Oct 23, 2018

Aldarc said:
It was an error on my part to use terminology that loaded. Angry DM talks about this is in his own article complaining about Inspiration. There is not really a mechanical or in-fiction connection between how one earns and spends Inspiration.

In contrast, in Fate a PC gains fate points (FPs) through two means: Refresh and Compels. Refresh is the amount re-gained at the start of every session. With compels, the GM (rarely other players) offer the player a FP to accept a narrative complication based on the PC's Trouble aspect, though possibly also other aspects. But on the other side of things, the player can only spend those FPs on things that pertain directly to their character Aspects. In order to spend a FP (to reroll, gain a +2 bonus to the roll made, declare a story detail), the player must invoke one of their Aspects in a manner that is relevant to the fiction. Now in Fate, your Aspects are the bulk of your character. They describe who you are as a person. So this is a forefront element, and the FP economy of aspect invokes/compels makes it a central part of playing a character. In contrast, the player is spending Inspiration on whatever. Just a random roll without any connection to the Bonds/Flaw/Ideal system (or whim of the DM) that garnered that Inspiration.

Fate Points are regarded as dissociative mechanics in how spending them comes from a player decision. However, the means that they are gained and spent all connect closely with reinforcing the character concept in-narrative as expressed in the Aspects/Trouble.

I think they kinda try replicating this idea through the Personality Traits of Inspiration, but it falls a bit flat IMO. And this dissonance is fairly clear from the flavor text and the mechanics:
Here, there is the idea that Inspiration will be spent in a way in-fiction that is congruent with the character's associated personality trait. Okay, neat. The reality? Not so much:
And this cognitive dissonance is where it ultimately falls flat for me. It ain't got no soul in how it works.

Thing is, I love Fate, and I don't mind meta-mechanics as a general principle. But the implementation of Inspiration feels somewhat cumbersome and half-hearted.

If I'm reading this correctly, one of your complaints about Inspiration is that you get it for, say, roleplaying your character, and then 10 minutes later you get to spend it on, say, an attack. And it can be a pretty tall order to connect the two in the fiction. It's pretty weak (and just uninteresting) to say, "Um....I think back to how it felt when I let my greedy side get the better of me, and it makes me angry so I channel all that anger into my swing..."

I get that. I'm not disagreeing.

I also just don't care. I don't see that as a flaw of Inspiration, party because I don't really hold as a goal for RPG design the elimination of mechanics that are hard to explain within the fiction. I really enjoy storytelling and roleplaying, and I also really enjoy the tactical metagame. A game that combines both is better than a game that is exclusively one or the other.

If the carrot of having a free re-roll in your pocket for emergencies helps induce players to do more roleplaying I think that's good.

Again, not that I think Inspiration as it is currently implemented is great design, as evidenced by the number of people who forget to use it.

TaranTheWanderer · Oct 23, 2018

In Fate, you have to use your Personality/flaw/ideal (traits) in order to spend a fate point.

You don't have to keep track of why you got it in the first place but spending it has to be 'in character'.

So, you might gain an Inspiration because you have a 'greedy' flaw. (Maybe you stole someone's money pouch which almost got you arrested.)

You can spend it on anything you want but it should make sense to the character. Spend it in combat because your character has the personality trait 'Together we stand, Divided we fall' and he's protecting his buddy.

I use this method to 'compel' or encourage players to complicate the story based on their traits. "Hey, your character is 'Greedy', I'll give you an inspiration if you steal that gold statue of the mayor's mantle." Then they can take the inspiration and risk getting caught. Or they just turn it down. Players love this kind of thing and will often take huge risks just for a point of inspiration.

I'll further add a use for Inspiration which was inspired by FATE, (which I posted in two other threads today but it applies)

2. Use inspiration to declare something.

Hey GM, i'm new in town. Can I use an inspiration to declare that I have a contact here in town? I have the Personality Trait, 'friend to the masses'.

You get some cool stuff happening where the players now add to the story. Instead of them asking, 'is there a torch somewhere?' and the dm rolling % or having to decide, the player just spends his inspiration. (DM decides what is acceptable). Declarations don't have to be limited 'stuff' either. If it makes the story more fun, you could declare that a specific NPC might be your 'ex-girl(boy)friend' - which could have positive or negative consequences depending how that relationship ended....which would be up to the table to decide.

In fact, you could do fun stuff like, "Hey DM, can I say that girl used to be my ex-girlfriend?" Offers an inspiration.

DM: "actually, that's a great idea. But why don't you keep your inspiration...and take another for good measure" (cackles)

iserith · Oct 23, 2018

Elfcrusher said:
If I'm reading this correctly, one of your complaints about Inspiration is that you get it for, say, roleplaying your character, and then 10 minutes later you get to spend it on, say, an attack. And it can be a pretty tall order to connect the two in the fiction. It's pretty weak (and just uninteresting) to say, "Um....I think back to how it felt when I let my greedy side get the better of me, and it makes me angry so I channel all that anger into my swing..."

I get that. I'm not disagreeing.

I also just don't care. I don't see that as a flaw of Inspiration, party because I don't really hold as a goal for RPG design the elimination of mechanics that are hard to explain within the fiction. I really enjoy storytelling and roleplaying, and I also really enjoy the tactical metagame. A game that combines both is better than a game that is exclusively one or the other.

What's more, if this is a problem for someone, then all that's required as a solution is to think up an in-fiction reason why it works the way it works. I don't give a flumph about it myself, but if I did, that's what I would have to do. Same way people justify how hit points work.

Guest 6801328 · Oct 23, 2018

iserith said:
What's more, if this is a problem for someone, then all that's required as a solution is to think up an in-fiction reason why it works the way it works. I don't give a flumph about it myself, but if I did, that's what I would have to do. Same way people justify how hit points work.

Yeah. We all do this ALL THE TIME. These games are just not even remotely realistic, so we have to tell ourselves all kinds of lies, constantly, to make the fiction somewhat believable. So to refuse to do that in cases where we simply don't like the mechanic is...well, fill in the blank.

CapnZapp · Oct 23, 2018

Aldarc said:
Thing is, I love Fate, and I don't mind meta-mechanics as a general principle. But the implementation of Inspiration feels somewhat cumbersome and half-hearted.

Sure.

Blue · Oct 23, 2018

5ekyu said:
I call them gimmick because they have dozen or more different names in each system which provides thrm - fate, drama, plot, story, hero, action, shineys, etc etc etc and gimmick points just saves time. They were not new - they have been around a long long time.

No, I don't accept that we should use a derogatory name on them just because the concept has had different names across different RPGs. It's like calling HPs or AC a gimmick, because it also has a lot of terms in different RPGs. If you want to call them a neutral name, go ahead. But don't pretend you're just giving them a common name and not putting them down when you use the term gimmick.

5ekyu said:
The **use** of them is to spend the point as a player and gain advantage- no "in character" requirement to use them, which means they are divorced from the character at time of use. "Goid dance last night" allows "advantage on initiative today."
Maybe yo you that's "in character" but it's not the style of play we like.

Now this is fair. I was focused on the getting of them, but this is a real criticism of spending them. At my table, they are usually spent in way of people going above and beyond because they are inspired (or Inspired) because they are Fighting for Queen and Country, or whatever the appropriate trait was. But you are right - by the rules there needs not be any connection. I agree, that's something to fix.

Hriston · Oct 23, 2018

I have a couple issues with the way inspiration is presented in the rulebooks.

The first has already been mentioned. It's how the way the mechanic is used doesn't match what's implied by the description, most notably the sentence about the Beggar Prince. It just seems sloppy.

Second, and I think this is more important, DMs should be encouraged by the rules to put their players' characters in situations that address their characters' personality traits. This can drive a more narrativist style of play and seems to be one of the untapped strengths of inspiration as presented.

77IM · Oct 23, 2018

So to bring this back around to the original topic (which was "how to improve Inspiration" and not "why your particular problem with Inspiration isn't valid")...

ad_hoc said:
Our table houserules inspiration to apply whenever it is relevant to a background trait. So just straight up advantage when a trait is relevant to what is happening.

[MENTION=6748898]ad_hoc[/MENTION]: How does this work out, in practice? How do you prevent it from being abused? Like, I could imagine someone with the Ideal of "Survival" wanting to get advantage on every single saving throw...

I'm asking because I really want to try this system for my next game. My biggest problem with Inspiration is the Traits/Ideals/Bonds/Flaws are very hard to use -- there's too many of them (5 per PC???) and a lot of them are not very well thought-out. Traits in particular are mostly role-playing prompts, and I don't see them motivating consequential actions the way Ideals, Bonds and Flaws might. I'm worried that someone with a Trait of "I always use big words" will do that (which is good) and consistently get advantage on all Charisma (Persuasion) checks (which is over-powered).

Ideas for Improving Inspiration

the Jester

Legend

Guest 6801328

Guest

Guest 6801328

Guest

TaranTheWanderer

Legend

iserith

Magic Wordsmith

Guest 6801328

Guest

CapnZapp

Legend

Blue

Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal

Hriston

Dungeon Master of Middle-earth

77IM

Explorer!!!

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