4E being immune to criticism (forked from Sentimentality And D&D...)

[Mallus]

To you, sure.

Yes I know, that's why I wrote it. What version of elves do you prefer? Again, quick-stepping into Faerie seems tres Elvish...

edit: there's a great representation of the this in the Russian films Daywatch/Nightwatch. The magician characters can step into an alternate dimension called the Gloom, which allows them to travel more quickly and through solid objects. Also, it looks terribly cool.

 

[Allister]

I think that some people are put off by a name that doesn't immediately bring an image to mind. I like the idea of hooking elves more closely to Faerie, myself.....I had a thread on EN World about the same not too horribly long ago, although what I did was very different from what WotC did.

I think that eladrin called "high elves" would have been very well received. (Shrug) Of course, I could be wrong.


RC

Hmm?

Eladrin == Eldar

Surely I wasn't the only one that went "Geez, WOTC is still milking the LOTR thing"

Hell, I thought the major "wrong" complaint would've been people saying WOTC is ripping off Warhammer (as many people probably didn't know that Warhammer got it from LOTR).

Not your response of "oh, that name doesn't mean anything".

Really, is the term Eldar THAT unkown?

 

[Raven Crowking]

Hmm?

Eladrin == Eldar

Surely I wasn't the only one that went "Geez, WOTC is still milking the LOTR thing"

Hell, I thought the major "wrong" complaint would've been people saying WOTC is ripping off Warhammer (as many people probably didn't know that Warhammer got it from LOTR).

Not your response of "oh, that name doesn't mean anything".

Really, is the term Eldar THAT unkown?

It has been pointed out that the LotR connection is even stronger than that!

But, yes, I think Eldar would have been better. And I think that "new races" as a replacement for old (as opposed to in addition to old) probably got a few backs up as well.

Like I said, though, I am glad that WotC went with a stronger Faerie connection, even though I don't like combat-dryads or the name "Feywild" (though I admit that, along with Shadowfell, Feywild is a name that grows on one somewhat).


RC

 

[RefinedBean]

Really, is the term Eldar THAT unkown?

Maybe I fail my geek test? I've never heard of the word before.

I don't mind Eladrin at all, but seriously...a teleporting race of Not-Elves with a stuck up attitude and mystical background?

Doesn't that scream PHB2 to anyone else?!

To stay on topic...I admittedly don't have a good deal of background in rhetoric. Is saying something like "Eladrin are fun, but half-orcs should have been in the PHB instead" a valid criticism? Isn't such a statement just an opinion disguised as fact?

 

[avin]

It's a far angrier, far less welcoming place than it was not too long ago.

Let's fix it! Redesign, ask Peter for a mini and bring Modrons to 4E.

Is teh winzor!

 

[ExploderWizard]

The step into Faerie and reappear in the mortal world several feet away. Seems both folkloric and high fantasy to me.

I agree with the concept. If thats what happens then they should be able to spend a bit of time there as well. If I am stepping into Faerie I might want to have the option of hanging out for more than a split second.

If the Eladrin are unable to do so then they are not cool residents of the feywild, they are teleporting elves.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Blink elves?

1e had blink dogs and (via The Dragon) blink mammoths.

 

[Mallus]

If thats what happens then they should be able to spend a bit of time there as well.

That's a lot harder to balance in game terms... but in principle, I agree. It's too good a concept to be used only for short-range teleportation.

 

[Allister]

Maybe I fail my geek test? I've never heard of the word before.

But it was even used in the LotR movies and is mentioned multiple times in the books as well as being used extensively in Warhammer. How can you NOT heard of that name?

I don't mind Eladrin at all, but seriously...a teleporting race of Not-Elves with a stuck up attitude and mystical background?

Doesn't that scream PHB2 to anyone else?!

Nah. It screams "wait, isn't that the race they ALWAYS split and present in the 3e campagn world books such as Greyhawk, the Realms and Dragonlance? About time they made it official".

I'm not kidding, look at those campaign worlds and they always seem like they have to create a High elf version....During 3e, I firmly believe they should've done it to being with...

To stay on topic...I admittedly don't have a good deal of background in rhetoric. Is saying something like "Eladrin are fun, but half-orcs should have been in the PHB instead" a valid criticism? Isn't such a statement just an opinion disguised as fact?

Good question.

I think this is opinion since even if you try to argue based on history, the fact that 2e didn't have the half-orc meant that the half-orc isn't an essential part of DnD since it wasn't core for 10 years there.

Of course, as a corollary, there's Mary Jane Watson who is considered "core" to the Spiderman franchise and herself was absent from the comic books for about 10 years in the last 70s/early 80s

 

[ExploderWizard]

That's a lot harder to balance in game terms... but in principle, I agree. It's too good a concept to be used only for short-range teleportation.

Yeah the range isn't a problem. Its not that much real distance that is travelled, the key is the other plane. Its yet another nice bit of flavor that seems limited to mostly combat use. Heck I could see an Eladrin stepping in, getting a bit of sleep, and returning to the prime material in the morning.