Fortune Cards Threads [Merged]

[MrMyth]

I think the problem is that "random minor bonuses" is, in many way, equivalent to "piles of new free utility powers".

Now, most of the time, players won't control what card they drew and whether it is useful or not - so nothing gamebreaking there.

The bigger issue is if someone has built a deck of effective, reliably useful rares. All my attacks are "Mind over Metal" - letting me always have my attacks target Will instead of AC. We've got daily item powers or encounter powers that do that sort of thing - but now players can basically get it on nearly half their attacks, for free.

Various Defense and Tactics cards can give you a "Stroke of Luck", which is a free reroll - usually when something bad has happened to you, but that includes stuff like provoking OAs, which you can set up. So suddenly a player is potentially generating free rerolls every other round, and a reroll is at least equivalent to an encounter power, if not a daily.

Will players with a handful of random Fortune Cards unbalance the game? Not really. But ones with an optimized deck will have a pretty direct increase in power level. Now, that is not inherently a bad thing.

But the players in my group are already pretty effective - no one really needs a power boost, especially one that adds even more fiddly bits to the game.

I can see uses for Fortune Cards outside of the way WotC is presenting them. But the default use for them just isn't something I have any need for. It might for others, and that's fine, but I don't think one can really declare them as having no impact on the game, either.

 

[jimmifett]

Various Defense and Tactics cards can give you a "Stroke of Luck", which is a free reroll - usually when something bad has happened to you, but that includes stuff like provoking OAs, which you can set up. So suddenly a player is potentially generating free rerolls every other round, and a reroll is at least equivalent to an encounter power, if not a daily.

There are only 8 cards that grant strokes of luck, only two of those are triggered by OA, and only one of those is triggered by YOU instigating the OA (the other requiring an ally to be attacked by an OA).

So, to get your reroll that you set up yourself via OA, you have a 1/10 chance at the start of encounter of drawing that card. You can't have multiples unless you increase the deck size by 10, and then it's only 1 additional copy per 10 cards, so it's always 1/10 chance at the start of the encounter. More copies means more potentially oppurtunities to use, but after that first use, your best chance of getting another copy is 1/19, 2/29, 3/39 etc.

Then you have to actually trigger your use of the power, sitting on that card for however many rounds until you use it. During those rounds, you aren't using other fortune cards.

So, under best conditions, you have 8/10 cards in your deck granting a re-roll. Of those, only 1 card can you activate through your own actions by triggering an OA against yourself, and one card an ally can trigger an OA for you to use that other card.

Once that card is used, it is discarded for the rest of the encounter. The rest of the stroke of luck cards have trigger conditions beyond your ability to control, so you have to sit on that card and not use any other fortune card bonuses that encounter, or discard it to try for another fortune card, and then it is gone the rest of the encounter.

Sounds fine to me.

 

[Scribble]

Sounds fine to me.

So you're saying when you DO actually benefit from these it's rather fortunate?

 

[jimmifett]

So you're saying when you DO actually benefit from these it's rather fortunate?

Exactly. The times i've used them at the start of my turn for hit bonuses, I hit on the d20 roll anyway. The tactics cards seem more useful so far.

The one I like is the one that allows you to move through enemies (albeit granting him a +2 to OA against you) so that you can get past the large brute blocking the hall and set up flanking for the rest of the party.

 

[jimmifett]

The bigger issue is if someone has built a deck of effective, reliably useful rares. All my attacks are "Mind over Metal" - letting me always have my attacks target Will instead of AC. We've got daily item powers or encounter powers that do that sort of thing - but now players can basically get it on nearly half their attacks, for free.

You are only allowed 1 copy of a card per 10 cards, so you can't have a deck filled with "Mind over Metal". So you get it maybe once an encounter. The larger your deck to have more copies significantly reduces your chances at being able to use a second copy.

 

[Dice4Hire]

You are only allowed 1 copy of a card per 10 cards, so you can't have a deck filled with "Mind over Metal". So you get it maybe once an encounter. The larger your deck to have more copies significantly reduces your chances at being able to use a second copy.

I don't think you are answering the point. I think the point is having all rares in a deck, and if that will be more powerful than a deck of mostly commons. I have looked on Troll an Toad and seen a lot of the cards, and an all-rare deck could be a lot better than all commons, though it vareis.

Another thing that worries me is making decks for specific characters. Like my rogue having lots of CA granting cards. Could be pretty strong.

 

[boolean]

You are only allowed 1 copy of a card per 10 cards, so you can't have a deck filled with "Mind over Metal". So you get it maybe once an encounter. The larger your deck to have more copies significantly reduces your chances at being able to use a second copy.

The "1 copy per 10" rule is specific to LFR. The general rules only require that at least 3 out of every 10 be each type.

So, for non-LFR play it is in fact legal to have four of the same card.

 

[jimmifett]

I don't think you are answering the point. I think the point is having all rares in a deck, and if that will be more powerful than a deck of mostly commons. I have looked on Troll an Toad and seen a lot of the cards, and an all-rare deck could be a lot better than all commons, though it vareis.

Another thing that worries me is making decks for specific characters. Like my rogue having lots of CA granting cards. Could be pretty strong.

Nothing big there. The thief build of the rogue can get CA nearly every single round with the right move action at-will.

Also, keep in mind DnD is a cooperative game, not mtg. No deck is going to "win" dnd. If anything, the DM will just throw harder monsters at you. Or, the DM can simply state that if fortune cards are going to be used, they be used in a communal pool, and then any "strategy" of a deck is out the window.

On a side note, seriously, what is with the vitriol against paper cards (or anything wotc happens to release), or players with money, or a company trying to make money? Is it simply a case of cheese being moved or is there something deeper? It's not like you are required to buy anything to play, aside from MAYBE a PHB1 or one of the Essentials books, and more often then not there are pregens or you can borrow a book. Does it really matter if someone has more damage output in combat? The enemies still die, and the players still get an equal share of XP when the battle is over. If anything, you get combat over with faster and can get back to actual roleplaying and story telling.

 

[Evilhalfling]

On a side note, seriously, what is with the vitriol against paper cards (or anything wotc happens to release), or players with money

Because it separates players into groups based on disposable income. The cards allow you to do more "cool things" based on the amount of real world money you spend on them. As a person with a small gaming budget, and who abandoned CCG in 2000, I have no interest or money to invest in a deck. So I resent the fact that a person could build the same character I have, but with the equivalent of an extra utility power which could be used multiple times in an encounter.
When running a game, I don't want to discourage my more casual players from playing the game, or slow down combat further with the additional set of minor tactical options. Some of my players would handle it quickly, others not so much.

 

[Storminator]

I've been thinking about some kind of hero points, like M&M. I used to hand those out for good jokes, cool RP moments, bringing beer, etc. Action points are too powerful for that, but Fortune Cards look perfect. I'll be bringing some to my next game.

PS