D&D 5E Campaign Settings 5e- Why I want to Forget the Realms

[Corpsetaker]

Well, if you've taken the trouble to manifest a perfect physical form, don't you want to show it off? And I think they're all kinky... the evil ones just get off to your pain.

With all the violence inherent in a game of murder-hobo antics, it would be bizarre if there was some kind of taboo against sexuality in any D&D setting. I know a lot of people gasp in horror and ask "What about the children?" but I say, if your kid's character can shove a sword through a goblin or set it on fire and watch it burn to death, then that character can also see a pair of goddess boobs without freaking the hell out.

Also, why would a creature with the power of the cosmos be worried about a mortal thing such as clothing?

 

[I'm A Banana]

Well, if you've taken the trouble to manifest a perfect physical form, don't you want to show it off? And I think they're all kinky... the evil ones just get off to your pain.

I mean, the male ones don't, so it's a little extra-noticeable when the ladies do. And it's certainly not Always True, just kind of a tendency that leaves me rolling my eyes a lot.

With all the violence inherent in a game of murder-hobo antics, it would be bizarre if there was some kind of taboo against sexuality in any D&D setting. I know a lot of people gasp in horror and ask "What about the children?" but I say, if your kid's character can shove a sword through a goblin or set it on fire and watch it burn to death, then that character can also see a pair of goddess boobs without freaking the hell out.

There is a HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE margin between "taboo against sexuality" and "I refuse to take part in this orgy where I have to sleep with my sister and this is my first big moral stand as a character."

Having some mild distaste for the latter in your dungeon-crawling fantasy games doesn't necessarily mean you have the former.

 

[bganon]

With all the violence inherent in a game of murder-hobo antics, it would be bizarre if there was some kind of taboo against sexuality in any D&D setting.

Yeah, I mean in real life you'd never find a society where sports in which fist-fights regularly break out are considered family entertainment but a woman discreetly nursing a child is deemed disgusting and offensive. That'd be some kind of bizarro fantasy world.

 

[Agamon]

Yeah, I mean in real life you'd never find a society where sports in which fist-fights regularly break out are considered family entertainment but a woman discreetly nursing a child is deemed disgusting and offensive. That'd be some kind of bizarro fantasy world.

Fantasy or not, every time I consider it, it strikes me as quite bizarre. Killing = death = good. Sex = life = bad. Seems bass ackwards, amiright?

 

[TheCosmicKid]

I'm not sure how this works post 4e and the death of a lot of the uber-NPCs due to the 100 year jump and Spellplague, but I've always viewed the powerful wizards of the Realms as basically being in a Cold War; If Elminster can show up and destroy Tiamat's cult in a spell, why can't Manshoon show up in Neverwinter and lay it to waste? For the most part, a lot of the time the uber-NPCs have is spent subtly checking the other uber NPCs. Elminster sends a group of heroes (that the Zhents, Red Wizards, or Church of Bane have no reason to be scrying on) to go do things because if he did them, he'd leave himself too open to an attack by someone wanting to take him down. So even if Elminster went and destroyed Tiamat's cult; he'd be spent on magic and resources and all it'd take is Manshoon to scry on and teleport in fully prepped and finish Elminster off.

If you think of it in the context of the USA/USSR Superpowers, it makes a lot of sense. Both nations had enough nuclear weapons to destroy the other, and they knew any real move against the other would insure Mutually Assured Destruction. So they acted through proxy nations and allies that were much smaller and less threatening in an attempt to gain the slightest advantage. The epic-level mages are the superpowers and they know using their best weapons will trigger others to use theirs (creating a Realms equivalent MAD) so they act through smaller proxy groups (red wizards, harpers, or random adventuring parties) to gain slight advantage.

Believe it or not, I actually was thinking about it in terms of the USA and the USSR. Here was my line of thinking: imagine you're writing a story set in the 1960s in Sweden or Pakistan or Hong Kong. If it's a love story or a crime drama or other "small-scale" tale, yeah, it makes sense that the USA and USSR would not have a presence in it. But as soon as there's an international incident or espionage intrigue or some other escalation of that sort, then the superpowers are going to make themselves known. There may not be ICBMs tracing apocalyptic parabolas through the upper atmosphere, because of the whole balance of power thing. But the goals, desires, and actions of the Americans and Russians are inevitably going to be deeply relevant, simply by the nature of the geopolitical situation of that era. It would be bizarre in the extreme, to the point of shattering suspension of disbelief, if you wrote this story and there was no mention of what the superpowers were up to.

That's how I understand Elminster. He may not always be teleporting in and solving problems with a fistful of fireballs. But as he is a one-man superpower, his influence has got to be accounted for in any crisis large enough to theoretically attract his attention. If he's not tossing fireballs around, then what is he doing? He's very smart and very meddlesome -- he's not just going to sit on his butt.

 

[TheCosmicKid]

Fantasy or not, every time I consider it, it strikes me as quite bizarre. Killing = death = good. Sex = life = bad. Seems bass ackwards, amiright?

You've been watching Zardoz, haven't you? Did you not heed the warnings? Sean Connery in a man-thong is not a sight that can be unseen!

 

[hawkeyefan]

The Realms are fine as the default setting. I myself enjoy departures from the norm such as Dark Sun and Planescape, but that does not mean there is no place for the norm.

The Realms are designed to be accessible and generic and kitchen sink. They're a skeleton waiting for a good DM and gaming group to clothe them in muscle and flesh.

Are they above reproach? No, of course not. There are plenty of criticisms we can make for the Realms.

But it seems a bit odd to me. Anything that you don't like about the Realms is within your ability to change. I mean, I can't see how someone would be willing to take Phandalin and its area and find a new home for it in the World of Greyhawk but not be willing to simply remove Elminster from their game world. Why is one change okay but the other not?

I've played in the FR plenty, as well as almost all the other published worlds and a good amount of homebrew settings as well. I don't find the FR so drastically different from the others.

The 3rd Edition FR Setting Book is fantastic, whether you want to play in the Realms or if you just want to mine the book for material to use elsewhere. I would say that the same goes for the 5E material so far. None seems so intrinsically tied to the Realms that it can't be easily ported to Greyhawk or any other setting.

Lowkey13, I would say that you should not give the Realms another try. I say this not because I don't think there is plenty for you to enjoy about the setting, but simply because your mind seems made up. I would say though, to use the comic analogy that came up earlier, that you sound like someone who didn't like Hawkworld and OMAC, so they find the DCU unbearable.

 

[Hussar]

They don't have to be there, but at a certain point it starts to strain verisimilitude that they're not. Elminster is an epic-level wizard with full access to divination spells; he doesn't literally have a "detect everything that happens" power, but what he does have comes pretty darn close. Sure, fifth-level PCs can probably clear out a gnoll stronghold or whatever without him getting involved, but major realm-spanning events? The DM has to account for him somehow.

I don't understand your point here. Isn't that supposed to be the "schick" of every campaign world, and thus, not a schtick at all?

Again, this does not seem to be a trait that distinguishes the Realms from any other campaign setting -- or, hell, any fantasy novel that a DM might care to use for a campaign setting.

Honestly, this is a point I really can't get behind. Every D&D setting (well, most of them anyway) has actual GODS that either directly or indirectly act upon the world. If there is a world spanning plot, why aren't the gods sending in teams of angels to deal with it? Sure, Elminister might be powerful, but, then again, so are half a dozen Solar's backed up with a couple of dozen Planetars.

"Oh, Demogorgon? You have a plot to create this big explosion that will separate you into two halves but, in the process, destroy half the world? Ok, well, I'm a god, I have eyes and ears all over the place and I'll just start answering a few of my followers prayers and see how your cultists deal with a horde of angels."

How is that any less believable than imagining that Elminister will get personally involved in every major adventure? Heck, if the party has a cleric in it, why can't that cleric pray to his god and get that god to deal with it?

If we can ignore the Powers not getting involved in a major realm-spanning event, why is it so hard to ignore Elminister? Or the Circle of Eight? Or the Lady of Pain? Or any other setting Mary-Sue's?

 

[TheCosmicKid]

Honestly, this is a point I really can't get behind. Every D&D setting (well, most of them anyway) has actual GODS that either directly or indirectly act upon the world. If there is a world spanning plot, why aren't the gods sending in teams of angels to deal with it? Sure, Elminister might be powerful, but, then again, so are half a dozen Solar's backed up with a couple of dozen Planetars.

My understanding has always been that the planar barriers are, by default assumption, difficult to penetrate even for the most powerful of beings, and gods and fiends work in the material plane through mortal agents because most of the time that's all they can do. I mean, that's why Orcus doesn't just go parading across the Sword Coast himself every week, isn't it?

 

[Hussar]

My understanding has always been that the planar barriers are, by default assumption, difficult to penetrate even for the most powerful of beings, and gods and fiends work in the material plane through mortal agents because most of the time that's all they can do. I mean, that's why Orcus doesn't just go parading across the Sword Coast himself every week, isn't it?

Ok, fair enough. Why aren't gods notifying their respective followers, with whom they can directly communicate, to deal with issues? Any realm-spanning plot would obviously affect their followers pretty negatively, and the higher ups can also summon/gate an angel who can then gate in more angels and deal with the problem.

Which sort of results in a MAD situation where the good and evil gods don't do this. Similarly, the good and evil moral major players don't do this as well because it would result in MAD.