D&D 5E What makes the Lucky feat so good?

[Li Shenron]

I didn't say it was your fault.

I'm saying it's not a good idea to argue the feat might be reasonable because its limitation. That limitation is one you don't want to enforce.

I like that limitation instead. I like the idea that I have to choose after seeing the dice but before knowing the outcome. In most cases it means I would use the feat when rolling low, but not when rolling average (although there are always cases when you can derive the roll you need based on previous rolls). The higher the original roll, the riskier the gamble. It kind of vibes well with me for a feat that represents being Lucky but essentially works by manipulating chance. Sometimes chance strikes back.

There are other abilities in 5e which allow you to choose after the outcome e.g. maneuvers that you use when you hit rather than when you attack but before you hit. But there are also many which you have to choose before you even know they will be applicable. Lucky is in the middle.

Overall the feat is still strong, but the limitation keeps it balanced. But obviously if you don't like the main benefit and neither the limitation, just ban the feat and write a completely new feat.

 

[guachi]

It's the best feat to take if you don't want to take an ASI, and don't have a specific feat in mind. It makes any character better, regardless of class, race, or build. (Specific feats can make specific builds better, but Lucky makes any character just a little bit better.)

The best and worst thing about the feat is the above. It's a generically useful feat for any PC any player is likely to play in any D&D game. Are d20s used in your game? If so, the Lucky feat is useful.

 

[Li Shenron]

You could roll a 3, use a luck point, roll a 20, and still fail.

A sensible DM probably should not ask for a ST roll if it fails also on a 20.

In the worst case, let's say you fail on a 19, and need a 20 to succeed.

There are DMs who tell you what roll results you need, and other DMs who don't. But whatever a DM's choice, that will affect everything , not just the Lucky feat. A lot of other decisions in the game will be made differently if you know the probability of success in advance.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

A sensible DM probably should not ask for a ST roll if it fails also on a 20.

While the general rule is that you should only roll when the outcome is uncertain, and it wouldn't be uncertain in this case, a sensible DM may not be aware that you would fail on a 20. One of the easiest ways that a DM can stay impartial is if they never ask for the PC stats.

On a practical note, I think that a player could probably make a safe guess that re-rolling a save at -1 against a very powerful enemy is unlikely to make a difference. Whether they need a 20 to succeed, or whether a 20 would still fail, spending a luck point would probably be a waste. (For my part, when I DM, I tell them the DC up front; but I also don't allow feats.)

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I think it is time to revert the sage advice about that one. The rules state clearly that anything manipulating dice only apply to one of the advantage or disadvantage dice. Reading the feat there is nothing that overrules that rule explicitely.

 

[Li Shenron]

While the general rule is that you should only roll when the outcome is uncertain, and it wouldn't be uncertain in this case, a sensible DM may not be aware that you would fail on a 20. One of the easiest ways that a DM can stay impartial is if they never ask for the PC stats.

As a DM, if I didn't notice, I would just give the Lucky point back.

 

[Satyrn]

A sensible DM probably should not ask for a ST roll if it fails also on a 20.

I'm one of those DMs Saelorn talks about in his reply. I have no idea what my players' saving throw bonuses are when I call for a roll. I don't really pay attention to their stats to begin with, though I will learn the specifics over time as they get used in play. But even then, the values may change at any time; the character might be under the effects of spells or conditions that boost or harm them, they might have given their save boosting amulet to another player - or received one - without me noticing. Any number of things.

I don't think I could ever say with certainty that a character is gonna fail on a 20.

But I assume what you really meant to say was "A sensible DM probably should not ask for a ST roll if he knows it fails also on a 20." Right?

 

[AmerginLiath]

The best and worst thing about the feat is the above. It's a generically useful feat for any PC any player is likely to play in any D&D game. Are d20s used in your game? If so, the Lucky feat is useful.

So, my homebrew system of replacing d20 rolls with consulting entrails for signs from the gods means that the feat is likely out the window?

 

[Patrick McGill]

The feat relies on the assumed encounter work-load, but I think most people do much less encounters per day and thus Lucky becomes really quite good because you're rolling overall like a third of the assumed rolls (roughly) the system thinks you'd be making.

It's why I'm switching my rests to fit the "grim" option in the DMG, though it won't be that grim and gritty. If I assume less than 1 encounter per day, then having short rests be overnight rests and long rests be a week in a town brings the game balance closer to the 4-6 medium encounters between "long rests". In this way I don't have to force a bunch of encounters within a single day just to keep class features and feats working as they should. Clearing a big dungeon would require multiple expeditions or else extreme frugality with resources, but I don't think that sounds so bad.

 

[Li Shenron]

I think it is time to revert the sage advice about that one. The rules state clearly that anything manipulating dice only apply to one of the advantage or disadvantage dice. Reading the feat there is nothing that overrules that rule explicitely.

If you are referring to PHB page 173, I am afraid I fell for that too... :/

While that paragraph indicates what is probably the RAI, its RAW unfortunately doesn't help with Lucky. Can you spot the reason?