Star Trek Discovery not getting any better I fear.

[oni no won]

I'll wait til season 2 is over so I can splurge watch (why I love Netflix so much!).

 

[Jester David]

That's your takeaway?

Mine is that in every fandom, there is a segment that is so toxic that they ruin anything they come in contact with by making sure than anything that doesn't appeal to them gets buried under unrelenting negativity and childish tantrums. This segment of fandom has climbed so far up its own ass that it is incapable of understanding that their tastes are not everyone's tastes and, well, even if they could recognize that fact, are so selfish and self absorbed that they simply don't care.

If it isn't tailored specifically to their tastes, then it's crap and must be unrelentingly attacked at every possible turn to make sure that all and sundry know just how much that segment of fandom is unhappy.

We see this with pretty much every fandom - Star Wars, Star Trek, D&D, whatever.

I'd expand the fandom to other activities. There's a lot of "toxic fandom" in sports as well. And there's no shortage of toxic music fans/ band groupies.
The takeaway is that people are jerks.

Fandom in general pushes people to that, because to be a fan of something intrinsically means you are passionate about that. And passion is an intense emotion that is inherently illogical. Passion always pushes people to do dumb things. Hence the innumerable stupid romantic gestures.
(When you get down to it, stalking is basically toxic fandom of an individual.)


There's a very fine line in people getting upset and complaining about franchises. There's a very slight distinction between valid complaints and childish tantrums. And, of course, when pushed by people who disagree, it's easy for a valid criticism to become a childish tantrum. Because passion.

Entitlement comes into it as well. And understandably so: people like stuff they like, and want to like new versions of stuff they previously liked. Fandom is made up of fans. And if you're not targeting the key fans of the franchise… who are you targeting?
Obviously, franchises need to grow, and few forms of media have a large enough base to be sustained entirely by hardcore fans. You need to appeal to general audiences while trying to grown the fandom. But that's still appeal to a theoretical audience (people who might be fans) versus the known audience. So expansion works best incrementally or supplementally. (Or, alternatively, maintaining the happiness of fanbase can be the purpose of the supplemental media.)

It's like when a band you love releases a new album and they completely change in sound. Doubly so if the new sound is more pop, so it feels like the band catering to mass markets.

Discovery is tricky and really ran into problems with this. It was trying to relaunch Trek on TV and there is a particularly diverse audience of fans. But there wasn't a lot of alternatives: it was like it or disengage with the franchise. For those fans that felt it wasn't "Star Trek" enough, there wasn't another show or the sign of a new movie on the horizon. Unlike, say, Deep Space Nine that always had TNG or Voyager running as alternatives.
Rather than trying to relaunch the franchise with a safe bet, like Star Trek: the Lost Era about the Enterprise-B and a show that really feels like Trek and hits all the tropes, they went with something that was "Star Trek" almost in name only. If that show was around, people would have been much more willing to overlook some of the elements of Discovery. But when it's the only show and the options are "watch DIS or stop watching new Trek" then that's a crap choice.
Yeah, I can just go and rewatch TNG… but I've done that already. Multiple times in the 24 years since it ended. DIS was the new Trek show people had been waiting and hoping for for twelve years. And to then have that not being something you like is beyond disheartening.
Being excited that some stranger on the internet that you don't really know likes it isn't much of a comfort.

 

[CapnZapp]

I don't consider myself particularly toxic when I point out that Discovery (and movies) give me close to zero "trek" feeling.

If they wanted to avoid justified criticism they should have made movies and shows about some new ship in an entirely different universe.

As long as companies both want to have cake and eat it too - reuse existing licenses in name only - fans will keep pointing this out in any outlet or forum to counterbalance more positive commentary.

 

[Zardnaar]

I don't mind discovery, the new Klingon look was confusing. Worf and the 80's Klingons is kinda how I view the race, I had to be told in season 1 they were actually Klingons (I had my suspicions but damn).

Grognard in me always prefers old, kinda like Star Trek but not really passionate about it. With geek culture its really on Star Wars and D&D I care about, maybe a handful of sci fi shows. Kinda explains why I couldn't get into Stargate Universe over the other 2, an ensemble cast playing lost in space didn't cut it for me. If I don't care about the characters why should I care about your show/movie?

I didn't watch Voyager or Enterprise, I barely remember TOS or TNG.

 

[Morrus]

As long as companies both want to have cake and eat it too - reuse existing licenses in name only - fans will keep pointing this out in any outlet or forum to counterbalance more positive commentary.

If you're posting just to further an agenda, rather than to contribute to a discussion, please find some outlet other than this forum for it.

 

[Morrus]

I had to be told in season 1 they were actually Klingons (I had my suspicions but damn).

Well, so did everybody. That's why they kept calling them "Klingons".

 

[Zardnaar]

Well, so did everybody. That's why they kept calling them "Klingons".

I know, I didn't really go for the new look that much. Not a trekkie as such but would have preferred a tweaked older look of the Klingon's. Watching DS9 and 4 episodes in I like it more than Discovery because I like more of the characters. Discovery is basically all about Burnham and I prefer the more ensemble approach I suppose. I like Cisco and Quark, Dax, Odo, Kira etc.

Orville is also great because of the characters, when Gordon is your least favourite but you still like him they're doing something right. Its basically why I liked SG1 and Atlantis over SGU.

 

[Hussar]

Just watched the latest Ep.

Daaaamn. That's about as Trek as it gets. Between this one and the last one, that's some fine story telling. And I love how Section 33 is no longer just the boogeyman black and white version of DS9. Much more nuanced.

Very, very cool.

 

[Aeson]

I'd like to think they're listening to fan feedback. They're adding in the elements the fans expect but are still telling the story the way they want. I see first season like the DM that doesn't listen to his players. They want something else but he had his "vision" and no one was going to mess with it. Now the DM is taking in feedback from players and allowing them to add their twist to his vision. On a micro scale it's easier to make everyone happy. Star Trek is too macro for that. Not everyone is going to be happy, but it's moving in the right direction. I am happy with the direction at least. Now I want to see where they want to take me with the story. All that to say I enjoyed this one also.

 

[Hussar]

I have to admit, I'm pretty lenient about Star Trek first seasons. Other than maybe the original series, every first season of any Star Trek series has ranged from pretty darn bad to godawful with writing and acting kinks still being worked out.

They came out of the gate with Disco pretty heavy handed, taking a firm stand on a lot of stuff and that annoyed a lot of people. But, now that all that stuff's established, they don't have to keep hammering away and they can just use it.

And, let's not forget, that these are the shortest seasons Star Trek has ever seen. They only have a dozen or so episodes to establish stuff instead of the 20-24 they had previously. There's really only so much you can do in the time they have, so, a lot of questions are going to have to wait for a next season.