• The VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!

Let's talk about chases, chase related products, and reasons to have them

Psion

Adventurer
Okay, I am bored of combats.

The other major classical tense action scene is the chase.

I want to put some in my game. Especially considering I am just about to usher my players into the world of airships.

So, a few questions to put forth.
1) I have Grim Tales. Do I need Hot Pursuit. (Yes, Barsoomcore and Gareth can feel free to tell my why I do, but I'd like to hear some other perspectives. ;) )

2) Anyone have a list of d100 chase scene scenarios. This seems potentially tricky to me. For a few reasons.

First off, players don't seem to appreciate the value of superior firepower ... or the notion that they might one day be faced with it. This may go hand in hand with my "turning up the lethality" post, but nonetheless: what are some scenarios that would make the players hesitant to stand and fight, given it is almost a given in D&D. I am thinking race situations and luring the enemy are two possibilities. Any others?

Second, another scenario is that where the PCs are superior, but the bad guy has something and is trying to get away. The problem is that (especially at the level my group is at) groups often have access to capabilities that can end chases fairly quickly. Teleport and the like.
 

log in or register to remove this ad

I don't have Grim Tales still, so I can't comment on that, but I've been very pleased with Hot Pursuit as a ruleset. It's tons of fun; easy to use, yet has a lot of depth for characters to do (or at least try) lots of different things.
 

Thornir Alekeg

Albatross!
One time I can think of the PCs getting chased is when they are unwilling to use force. Had one time where the PCs had been fingered as criminals. The city guard confronted them and were going to bring them in for questioning, unfortunately that delay would have allowed the BBEG to succeed in his plot - the PCs didn't want to fight the guards, they were only doing their duty, and couldn't take the time to explain things to people in authority, so they ran and a chase ensued. The PCs were able to elude their pursuers (of course I didn't yet have Hot Pursuit so I don't know how that might have changed things).
 

fafhrd

First Post
While it's not a complete system, DMGII has some advice for running foot chases. Regarding teleport, if the opposition has similar magical ability, you might look to anticipate teleportation from CArc. Rather than using the extra round(s) to buff, why not have them simply teleport to another, yet unscried, location?
 

Psion

Adventurer
Woops, along with chase related product quips.

Rooftop chases and alley chases are a few of my favorite things, but it is my understanding that Hot Pursuit doesn't handle these.

But does anyone lese remember the old 1e DM Design Kit? Amongst many forms in there, there was a chase design sheet that let you design a chase without really mapping out the area. The chase sort of presented random obstacles and opportunities. Anyone see anything like that recently? Or think that's suitable for adaptation to d20/3e?
 

Quickleaf

Legend
Glad you ask these questions, Psion!

Psion said:
I want to put some [chases] in my game. Especially considering I am just about to usher my players into the world of airships.

So, a few questions to put forth.
1) I have Grim Tales. Do I need Hot Pursuit. (Yes, Barsoomcore and Gareth can feel free to tell my why I do, but I'd like to hear some other perspectives. ;) )

Yes, absolutely get Hot Pursuit. The way it provides for different manuevers and is flexible to a player's wildest dreams are its high marks. And its low marks are, well, it's another system to learn (though it's pretty simple).

Psion said:
what are some scenarios that would make the players hesitant to stand and fight, given it is almost a given in D&D. I am thinking race situations and luring the enemy are two possibilities. Any others?

I posted about reasons why a high-level character would hold back, and I think these are really just universal strategy points that players may (or may not) consider:

Quickleaf said:
1. A sporting chance: Bravado is a common trait of heroic figures. The idea that a master of some art loves to be tested may lead to PCs choosing not to try other options just for the joy of testing themselves (and proving their superiority!). Perhaps the PC simply doesn’t believe that anyone could pull a fast one on them. In either case, of such role-playing is appropriate to the character’s personality, it merits extra experience points, anywhere from 10 to 20 times the character’s level.
2. Conservation of energy: You never know when you’re going to need those vastly powerful yet limited resources, so it is better to keep them stored up for truly desperate situations. Sometimes it makes sense not to waste time and energy on the little fish when there’s a much greater threat on the horizon.
3. I’ve got a reputation to maintain: In the case of reputable heroes, sending the entire party against a meager thief and interrogating him with force and magic would be detestable to anyone observing. Such a disproportionate response is never seen as heroic unless their enemy is truly hated and feared by the public. When others witness or learn of the PC’s dishonorable actions, their reputations could suffer.
4. Observed by their enemies: In this case, a PC might not want to give away her hand too son to her enemies. Once an enemy knows a PC’s strengths, they can tailor defenses to counteract those strength. Embroiled in political intrigue, the PCs often won’t know when their enemy’s servants are observing them.
5. He’s worth more alive: If an enemy can be questioned for useful information, or traded for ransom or a favor later, it’s better to keep them alive than, say, cast disintegrate.
6. Deterrence: The PCs and their enemies may have vast resources that could destroy cities if not nations. If neither side is willing to risk the massive loss of life that would follow an all-out conflict, they may resort to more under-handed methods. Often this involves researching and spying on your enemy to find their weak spot, and exploiting it.

Psion said:
Second, another scenario is that where the PCs are superior, but the bad guy has something and is trying to get away. The problem is that (especially at the level my group is at) groups often have access to capabilities that can end chases fairly quickly. Teleport and the like.

This is tricky to do without making the players feel you're pulling the "I'm the GM, screw you" card, and, as you point out, it is compounded by access to D&D spells. I remember a great desert chase I had planned; round 1 the mage casts hold person and drops the target out of their saddle. Chase is over before it began.

To really address this, we need to look at a few assumptions about magic & crime:

1. How is the casting of spells viewed in civilized parts of the world? Is it even legal? Must you file a request to be legally allowed to cast a spell in a city? What are the consequences for breaking this law?
2. In a world where a police officer can cast hold person on a fleeing criminal, what chance does crime have? The criminals surely have grown smarter and developed their own magical counter-abilities. What about casting mirror image prior to a chase, with the addition that several of the villains cronnies (dressed in identical clothes) join the chase. So now you're not chasing one, but 3, 4, 5, or more bad guys, some of which aren't even real! And it's even more complex if the villains throw in a decoy object. "Ok, I surrender! Just don't hurt me! Take this magical gizmo!"
3. If the players can take off their kit gloves and break the law, then surely criminals will respond likewise. They will employ all manner of tactics that they never could in a city, such as: Smearing contact poison on the object (or its decoy). Summoning the city watch to stop the people accosting them. Ducking into a crowd and performing a swift disguise (might need a feat to do that!). If the party has teleportation, give the criminal teleportation. If the party has hold person, have the criminal cast it upon them first. Fleeing villain might go through an escape route with magically enchanted mirrors, or some other trap. Taking a hostage. Throwing a magical deterrent behind them (a golem-like creature that drains spellcasting levels or shoots poison darts). Drops some caltrops...poisoned or enchanted of course. Flee into a really, really dangerous area (foundry with sparks everywhere, an asteroid belt, a sleeping dragon's lair where any speaking wakes the dragon, an anti-magic field).

As an aside, why are the PCs facing inferior opponents anyhow? :)
 

Quickleaf

Legend
Psion said:
Rooftop chases and alley chases are a few of my favorite things, but it is my understanding that Hot Pursuit doesn't handle these.
That's right, Hot Pursuits doesn't specifically handle rooftop chases and alley chases.

The way I run rooftop chases: Someone on a rooftop has cover from those on the ground. Climb check required to get to roof. Jump checks intermittently required when leaping from roof to roof. Balance checks required when walking on narrow beams. Chance of falling through certain rooftops.

The way I run alley chases: Intermittent chace of getting lost (using my house rules about Knowledge (local) helping to find your way in the city), with a variety of results including running back into the chasers. Tight quarters if a fight breaks out. Lots of people in the way provide cover from spellfire/ranged attacks. Chance for tripping over debris (snake charmer baskets, melon stalls, sleeping beggars, etc).

Psion said:
But does anyone lese remember the old 1e DM Design Kit? Amongst many forms in there, there was a chase design sheet that let you design a chase without really mapping out the area. The chase sort of presented random obstacles and opportunities. Anyone see anything like that recently? Or think that's suitable for adaptation to d20/3e?
Hmm, with your mention of a 100 chase complications list to the DM Design Kit, I gather that you'd like a list of random elements you could throw into a chase in the city. This would make a great "100s thread" - you could post it; I'm sure lots of us would contribute! :)
 

iwatt

First Post
Psion said:
Woops, along with chase related product quips.

Rooftop chases and alley chases are a few of my favorite things, but it is my understanding that Hot Pursuit doesn't handle these.

Actually, Corey also got Hot Pursuit: On foot on RPGNow for all those foot chases heis original ruleset didn't cover.

The great thing about Hot Pursuit is that the chases are dynamic since you get away from the grid. It does take some good preparing (sample obstacles) and a willingness to improvise on the fly (or be really really really prepared befoerhand :heh: ) since PCs ability to come up with confounding tactics during chases is astounding.
 

Psion

Adventurer
Quickleaf said:
Hmm, with your mention of a 100 chase complications list to the DM Design Kit, I gather that you'd like a list of random elements you could throw into a chase in the city. This would make a great "100s thread" - you could post it; I'm sure lots of us would contribute! :)

Sure, why not. Part of the question I was asking was "is there one". But if not...

d100 chase complications
 
Last edited:

GMSkarka

Explorer
Psion said:
Rooftop chases and alley chases are a few of my favorite things, but it is my understanding that Hot Pursuit doesn't handle these.

True, sort of.

Hot Pursuit doesn't specifically handle them, but it's fairly simple to extrapolate using the rules given....and if you need more detail, Hot Pursuit: ON FOOT gives you more to work with.

I've used the products to run rooftop and alley chases in my Skull & Bones campaign.

(That's all the plug I'll give, though. I think our customer's experiences speak well enough for the product---Thanks, guys!)
 

Remove ads

Top