D&D 3E/3.5 [3.5] within 5 feet/5 feet away

[Zeppo]

The SRD description of the fog cloud spell says, "The fog obscures all sight, including darkvision, beyond 5 feet. A creature within 5 feet has concealment (attacks have a 20% miss chance). Creatures farther away have total concealment (50% miss chance, and the attacker can’t use sight to locate the target)."

All well and clear, but descriptions of similar effects, such as obscuring mist, say thusly: "The vapor obscures all sight, including darkvision, beyond 5 feet. A creature 5 feet away has concealment (attacks have a 20% miss chance). Creatures farther away have total concealment (50% miss chance, and the attacker cannot use sight to locate the target)."

Am I right in interpreting that in both cases, creatures adjacent to the observer have concealment and all other creatures have total concealment? Or does the latter text mean that there is a progression of adjacent = normal vision, "one square away" = concealment, farther = total concealment?

 

[Omegaxicor]

I think (I would rule) that they were written by different people and mean the same but are worded differently (well obviously they are worded differently)

The creature is the centre and adjacent creatures have 20% concealment while creatures further away have 50% with both spells

 

[Zeppo]

Ok, thanks! I think I'll rule it that way as well.

 

[Vegepygmy]

Am I right in interpreting that in both cases, creatures adjacent to the observer have concealment and all other creatures have total concealment?

Yes.

 

[Omegaxicor]

Yes.

wow very well said but a little bit late and redundant?

 

[Vegepygmy]

wow very well said but a little bit late and redundant?

"I think (I would rule) that..." was too wishy-washy for me.

 

[Omegaxicor]

Touché...

 

[ImperatorK]

Maybe Fog Cloud gives concealment even within the casters square, while Obscuring Mist doesn't?
Or maybe it means that Fog Cloud gives 20% concealment in adjacent squares ("5 ft. away") and 50% on further squares, while Obscuring Mist gives no conealment on adjacent squares ("5 ft. away", which might mean "not within 5 ft.") and 50% on further squares?
IMO it's the later.

 

[Vegepygmy]

Maybe Fog Cloud gives concealment even within the casters square, while Obscuring Mist doesn't?

No, it's just two (very slightly) different ways of saying the same thing.

D&D tends to deal with things in increments of 5 feet (or 1 square). Something is either in your square, adjacent/5 feet away/within 5 feet, or some other number of squares or distance in feet divisible by 5 away.

The interpretation of obscuring mist you suggest would have it provide 20% concealment only for creatures exactly 5 feet away. 4.9999 feet away would mean no concealment, and 5.0001 feet away would have 50%. Since the game doesn't deal in such tiny distances, how would we even adjudicate that? Not to mention how absurd the premise is in the first place.

A creature in an adjacent square is "5 feet away" from you, but the game doesn't mean exactly 5 feet away from you. It really just means "1 square away" from you, and anything "within 5 feet" of you is within that 1 square.

(There, you made me post a long answer. Omegaxicor should be happy now. )

 

[ImperatorK]

I interpret "5 ft. away" as beyond the adjacent square. The distance is measured from the edge of the casters square. A square has 5 ft., so if it's "5 ft. away" then it cannot be within the first square. Both spells even say that they obscure vision beyond 5 feet. And I don't believe it means the same thing. Fog Cloud is almost an exact copy-paste of Obscuring Mist, they just added a sentence or two.