EzekielRaiden
Follower of the Way
Truthfully, I don't know much of his background. I thought the thread fascinating because he was representing himself as an old school GM (which I easily qualify for having run games since '84 and with probably more hours of AD&D GMing than only an incredibly minute portion of the world's gaming population!) who had some measure of apathy or ambivalence to 4e until a very recent bout of intrigue. Did he have an edition warrior past? Was he an ardent member of the OSR? Neither? I was curious.
But perusing (very shallow-like) that thread, I see some analysis and invocation of indie games (PBtA games, Torchbearer, Cortex+, and I believe Fate?). So maybe he and I have a lot more in common if he likes those games too (he appears to have at least a passing understanding of them if not an outright interest). How will his position on 4e SCs spin out of that (if true)?
I get the feeling, from my own reading of those threads, that he came into the hobby relatively early too (no later than 2e and probably much earlier), stuck around until 3e came out and decided it wasn't his flavor, which led to him looking into other games and ideas, particularly PbtA games. Personally, from my experience with other DMs specifically running PbtA games, I definitely think it's having a positive influence. Part of it is just...Dungeon World makes a point of putting each player's choices, from the bottom up, in a central game place. The fact that someone is The Wizard--not merely a wizard--sets a little bit of the tone and direction of your game. Similarly, our game would not at all be the same if I had played a Sorcerer (my original, speculative choice, before a spot opened and left a need for a Defender, aka my favorite class, the Paladin!)--the religious overtones and devotional aspect of Seth would not be present, and it would have tweaked the narrative in a different direction. These kinds of lessons, which have always been important for tabletop play, are pushed front-and-center by Dungeon World's design, and I think that leads to Really Good Things for ANY future game a person runs. There's good reasons why, despite always wanting more bells and whistles to play with, I have SUPER fond memories of playing DW.
I just found it interesting and I'd like nothing more than for 4e to get a fair look (even a cult renaissance) after its "demise," which it sure as hell didn't get during its run. I've seen a lot of utterly unhinged peasants with pitchforks tribalism in my life. What 4e got was right up there with the best (worst) of it. I will never, ever, ever accept the appeasement line of the trolling/attack to defense ratio was anywhere near 50:50 in either frequency or virulence.
Yeah, 4e got a bad rap. We'll see how things evolve with time. It would be lovely for 4e to get a thorough renaissance treatment, one that kept true to the core spirit while polishing it up. Most people who have enough interest in that, I find, tend to want to go much, much further...I coined the phrase "mutations" as opposed to "clones" because, well, a lot of people making a so-called "4e clone" are producing a game that's very, very different. Sharply decoupled roles, for example. The "Trifold" series (from Neonchameleon, over at RPG.net) is probably the closest it gets...and even that still takes a LOT of liberties (for example, the Paladin, Cleric, and kinda-sorta Warlock get smushed together into a single class).
But I'd rather not dwell too much on exactly HOW bad a reception 4e got. We've had enough threads that did--and are doing!--that.