A new class for Elves? [think Tolkien here]

[Nyaricus]

Personally, I find it... amusing?... that you are attempting to model a Tolkein-inspired class on a Tolkein-inspired race.

Why thank you. All the base races IMC have changed to reflect tolkiens races. Elves, Dwarves, Hobbits (damn! i mean . . .halflings, yeah, halflings . . .) Orcs are all per thier Middle Earth counterparts, as much as i can. For other creatures, i only use real-world folklore and mythology for them, and many monsters from the Monster Manuel have been revamped to reflect this, as well. No mind flayers in my world, no sir-ee!

If you go waaaaaay back to OD&D, the original Elf class was a Fighter/Mage combination, requiring 4000 XP to hit level 2.

In all seriousness, though, I'd consider making the class some sort of gestalt class between Druid and Sorcerer, then trim it down by using the WORSE statistic of each class as the base. Or, use Bard as the base, and tailor your spell list appropriately.

that's pretty much what i want here. a Druidic type, without the priest, and a sorcerer without the fireball.

15 second design question > is arcane spellcaster appropriate, or would you go with divine? comments?

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By the way, that you everyone for all the excellent feedback thus far. This is an awsome discussion guys

 

[Herobizkit]

15 second design question > is arcane spellcaster appropriate, or would you go with divine? comments?

How about dropping concepts like arcane and divine and just having magic as magic? IMC, I dropped the concept of divine magic altogether and made everyone learn spells like wizards.

From what I remember, the Tolkeinites don't have any major world-changing priests of any type, so I'd go arcane if you have to pick. Just treat all Druidic spells as arcane, and you're all set.

Oh yes, I'm also a gamebreaker DM.

 

[Sigurd]

Arcane Or Divine?

I'd have to say Divine:

Based primarily on Gandalf: He seems to look to books for knowledge not spells. He was created knowing the spells he does like a sorceror or cleric - same for Saruman. At the gates of Kazadum gandalf says "I once knew every spell in Elf, dwarf....." - I think magic is a gift from dieties. He doesn't really carry a spellbook. Dont forget the council of the white are Istari Not humans.

Is there a mention of a magic caster among the Mannish races other than the witch king???

Gondor has no court magician or wizard.

I believe the books mentions that Sauron teaches magic to the witch king. Who in turn teaches it to followers. It always seems that magic is tied to who you are not what you know.

If magic was arcane it might have survived more significantly into the third age. As it is, when the magic people leave their inherant magic leaves with them. Certainly herbs, items, auspicious days & even prayers might be magic but I don't think there is any that is not eventually tied to a racial type or religion. Divine\druid magic.

so says me anyway

Sigurd

 

[Nyaricus]

How about dropping concepts like arcane and divine and just having magic as magic? IMC, I dropped the concept of divine magic altogether and made everyone learn spells like wizards.

holy crap man. That's probably the most sensible thing to do. I'd stil go with Arcane Spell Failure, but that's just a given with magic. You must be unencumbered to use it. Magic is magic is magic

From what I remember, the Tolkeinites don't have any major world-changing priests of any type, so I'd go arcane if you have to pick. Just treat all Druidic spells as arcane, and you're all set.

my world is Tolkien-inspired. My cmapign is set in about 1050 AD in the real world, and has many themes taken directly from Tolkien. I went to the source of modern medieval fantasy for inspiration in many things, folklore and mythology for the rest, adn my own imagination for things like geography, nations and many other things as well.

Oh yes, I'm also a gamebreaker DM.

definition: ?

 

[Herobizkit]

This is my definition, anyhow.

Gamebreaker (adj): A DM who ignores restrictions (such as pesky things like alignment, level adjustment for powerful races, "regular" treasure allotment/level and so on), houserules all sorts of nifty rules to replace the ones he doesn't like, delves into all sorts of OGL stuff, and generally handwaives (sp?) anything that is generally considered "unbalancing". Its antonym is "Coremonger", also "invented" by me and posted somewhere on EnWorld.

 

[Nyaricus]

Arcane Or Divine?

I'd have to say Divine:

Based primarily on Gandalf: He seems to look to books for knowledge not spells. He was created knowing the spells he does like a sorceror or cleric - same for Saruman. At the gates of Kazadum gandalf says "I once knew every spell in Elf, dwarf....." - I think magic is a gift from dieties. He doesn't really carry a spellbook. Dont forget the council of the white are Istari Not humans.

Is there a mention of a magic caster among the Mannish races other than the witch king???

Gondor has no court magician or wizard.

I believe the books mentions that Sauron teaches magic to the witch king. Who in turn teaches it to followers. It always seems that magic is tied to who you are not what you know.

If magic was arcane it might have survived more significantly into the third age. As it is, when the magic people leave their inherant magic leaves with them. Certainly herbs, items, auspicious days & even prayers might be magic but I don't think there is any that is not eventually tied to a racial type or religion. Divine\druid magic.

so says me anyway

Sigurd

Good Points as well, Sigurd. I didn't see your post as i was posting mine at enarly the same time (just got distracted with other things, so i was in the "post reply area for awhile).

Hmmm, many points here make sense, and yet magic is magic in middle earth. The only reason we think "is this arcane or divine?" is because TSR adn WotC scupted us to think like that. I really am liking the idea of "magic is magic" but i suppose i will have to think how this will affect many aspects (like sacred and profane bonus's, etc.

I'd say more, but for now i need to sleep. More in the next few days . . .