D&D 5E Ability Check origins at your table

[AmandaBarbarian]

MANSPLAINING. Where the DM THINKS they know better then a real life experienced expert and actually gives negatives for doing the thing that would work.

as far as I know the example I gave from my friend was 2 men... but yeah, I have already experienced a bit of sexism in the hobby and more then a bit of elitism, I don't know why this should shock me but it did.
I wonder how many people have been driven out of TTRPGs for this?

 

[Swarmkeeper]

so you do understand that "Can I use insight to see if he is being sneaky?" is BOTH asking for a skill check AND helping the narrative AND playing the game?

Of course. And it is not wrong or bad or unfun. That's just not how we strive to play at our table.

 

[AmandaBarbarian]

I don't follow this metaphor.

I had more then one teacher that if me or another student would say "I have a question to axe" or "Can I axe you a question" would make us restate it as "I have a question to ask" or "Can I ask you a question" before we could move forward. I also had way too many teachers that would say "aint isn't a word" even when we proved them wrong by finding it in dictionaries and giving full definitions.

the teacher understood what the request or statement was, they just didn't like the words used to make it.

I feel lik you and others here are doing the same.

At our table, I literally don't understand exactly what a player means when they say "I use Perception". I need more clarification than that.

why? "I want to look for more detail" and "I use perception" will almost always mean the same thing. The times they don't you can take in the context and figure it out. SO yeah if 100 time someone calls for a skill by name and 10 of those times you need to ask for clarity that makes sense to me, but if it's 50 times, or 80 times or all 100 times that seems like it is not just you needing clarity but you policing what people are saying and how.

Indeed, I come here to learn from how others play and share how we play. I'm not here to put other people down. I would ask that you read my posts through that lens, please.

I am trying, but to be perfectly honest, I can't even imagine having fun at a table and making friends when I am told "No, you have to say that a different way"

 

[AmandaBarbarian]

Of course. And it is not wrong or bad or unfun. That's just not how we strive to play at our table.

but WHY? that's the thing, if someone came to your table like me and used asking for skills, would that make the game less fun for you as a DM, or for other players at your table?

 

[Voadam]

so you don't use the skill system at all?

Sure I do.

When I want to abstract out and not play out something that is when mechanics are useful. When I want an element of risk modified by expertise I use the skill system.

During downtime the bard wants to do a whisper campaign to pit two gangs against each other. Often a skill check.

When the party was escaping from a gang headquarters being chased by ghouls and hobgoblins Indiana Jones style, I ran a 4e style skill challenge with each member contributing action choices and rolls for an entire game to see if they got away or had to fight.

A monster sneaks up on the party for an ambush, stealth versus passive perception.

The robot artificer wants to hack the electronic lock on the crashed alien space ship, pick locks tool proficiency check.

Often I resolve things based off of the player's descriptions though with no rolling. Lots of social interactions there are no rolls, just talking in character.

Sometimes I use 5e's binary trained or not skill system and use that as a guide with no skill roll. More often it is based on a character's specific concept. So the PC who is an alien science experiment the party freed from a cryopod on an ancient crashed space ship does not know the local heraldry. The cleric of the dragon cult in the badlands has some basic knowledge of the southern theocratic empire and their intolerance of foreign religions, more about the local druidism, and a lot about the dragon cult.

 

[AmandaBarbarian]

Often I resolve things based off of the player's descriptions though with no rolling. Lots of social interactions there are no rolls, just talking in character.

I am floored by this one. So a player that is more social and more able to talk at the table will always have the advantage over a shy player?

 

[HammerMan]

I am floored by this one. So a player that is more social and more able to talk at the table will always have the advantage over a shy player?

The Cha skills is another hold over.

Way back in the Dino riders times of 2e we didn’t have any social skills or systems really so it was all player skill

Starting with 3e there was a big “bad wrong fun” push to either not use them at all or use them as little as possible to keep player skill over character skill.

 

[Voadam]

why? "I want to look for more detail" and "I use perception" will almost always mean the same thing.

That is not the distinction being sought. "I walk up to the chest, stay a foot away from it, do not touch it, and look for discoloration or a sheen that indicates there could be a contact poison. Next I will look for areas on the chest that it looks like poison needles could jab out from." allows the DM to adjudicate whether the player walks right onto the illusion covering the pit trap in front of the chest.

 

[billd91]

It might be helpful to note that he didn't say "doesn't ever matter", or even words to that effect. We should be careful not to misrepresent what each other says here, or communication will grind to a halt.

Are you kidding me? Oh, sure, he didn't say "doesn't ever matter", Hussar just said this, pretty obnoxiously:

Oh good god. Why?

Who cares? Fast or slow doesn’t matter. It’s not in the players control. Squatting? Wtf? Seriously? You seriously expect players to describe their posture when picking a lock when they probably have zero idea what that lock actually looks like?

How does that NOT imply that el-remmen's concerns would NEVER matter?!? el-remmen interpreted Hussar correctly. Don't chide him while sparing Hussar.

 

[Oofta]

so you don't use the skill system at all?


omg that is a long time. So, why did it start? how can people not agree? I don't understand any of this.

this sounds a lot like kicking players out of play groups, and again that seems the opposite of the point of the games. I was taught this was first and for most a game for people to make new friends.

wow... That has to be an exaggeration, DMs can't really think they need to punishes a player for not using the right terms?

There is a poster who will literally kick people out of their game if they don't state actions in the "correct" way. I can't imagine doing that or playing with a DM that did.