Agreeing to Bad Ideas

[Celebrim]

It won't be that long before he can ensure that he can't fail that check. Remember that natural 1s don't auto-fail on skill checks.

I assume that his chosen DC is such that he will never fail any of the checks starting from 1st level. He simply starts play with Skill Focus (no a useless pick in this circumstance) and maximizes the skill at each level, and he never fails any check. I personally as a DM would have at the least required DC 12 + 3 * spell level. I assume that the OP doesn't yet realize just how much they've been had.

 

[RedSiegfried]

Being the kind of DM who hates to have to say no to any player idea, I would go with the player's idea for the custom spell system, but not use it exclusively. In other words, let him do what he wants but only a limited number of times per encounter or day or whatever. You can explain that it's a compromise with the rules that gives him the freedom to do what he wants but balances that freedom with the rest of the system so his power level doesn't get to high too quickly, and if other people want to do the same thing they could have that option and it is less likely to break the system.

Also let him know as referee you reserve the right to revoke or modify the system at any time, as long as you inform him of it in advance.

 

[RedSiegfried]

I assume that the OP doesn't yet realize just how much they've been had.

My experience with stuff like this is a lot of times the player has good intentions and doesn't even realize what a can of worms he's opening. Explain to him openly and transparently how it's your job to help him have his fun but at the same time also keep the worms in the can. Breaking the system has a high chance of making the game less fun for people.

 

[ccs]

I was just curious if there was ever a time in your experience as a GM where you, against your better judgement, made a decision that you knew was probably a bad idea. Did it work out in the end, or did you end up regretting it?

Well, I keep letting my buddy Josh rejoin our game....
If he's in the game longer than 7 or so sessions it almost never ends well.

 

[rabindranath72]

The old Dragonlance SAGA game had an interesting "spell building" system, which I reckon should be relatively easy to port to D&D. The core idea was to have some general "spell schools" which defined the domain of the spell, and then build up a difficulty based on summing scores according to different qualities, e.g.: number of creatures affected, range, area of effect, damage etc. The final score gave an idea of the overall difficulty of the spell. The system also assumed that there were essentially two "meta schools" of spells, one which affected living things directly (e.g. sleep and charm would fall into this category); these spellcasters would be called Mystics. And another "school" whose spells affected non-living matter (e.g. rock to mud and fireball would fall into this category); these spellcasters would be called Sorcerers.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

You could look at Words of Power, which is a Pathfinder supplement, but close enough to 3e.

 

[Celebrim]

So, thinking about this more, if I were you I'd do the following.

1) Go back to the player and say that while you are still OK with his idea, you think that as a practical matter the mechanics you've offered are just too strong. What you will offer him is still too strong, but at least it will be more balanced.

2) Require him to take a custom Trait 'Improvisational Caster' (as a feat only available at first level) to gain access to the ability he wants. Basis his class on the Wizard, not the Sorcerer so that he isn't getting the advantage of a massive amount of spell slots as well as full flexibility. Alternatively, use a Sorcerer's progression (3rd level spells at 6th), but decrease maximum spell slots by 2 to match the wizard, effectively creating a subclass.

3) Increase the DC to 12 + 3 * Spell Level to successfully improvise a spell. Tell him he can ONLY improvise spells, so every spell will have some small chance of failure. Alternately, if he wants to be able to cast spells from his spell slots normally and spontaneously improvise spells, increase the DC to 16 + 3 * Spell Level.

4) Whenever a spell fails, he has to make a DC 10 wisdom check (straight up) or else the spell misfires (as a failed Use Magic Device check, but feel free to improvise these misfires through whatever method you like).

5) Avoid having skill boosting magic items in your game, or if you do have them, make them cost 10 or 20 times as much and cap the bonuses as +5.

 

[Dandu]

6) He can only improvise a spell of one school by expending a spell of the same school.

 

[BlackSeed_Vash]

Might I suggest Words of Power from Pathfinder. This variant spell casting is like a more dynamic use of the Dragon Shouts from Skyrim. Spells are broken up into 3 components; Target, Effect and Meta. A player starts off knowing all the Target Words and the Boost Meta Word, though not all of them are usable at first level. Each time a player's class would gain a new spell, they chose a new Effect or Meta word less than or equal to their highest spell slot. Once a player can cast 3rd level or higher spells, they can chose to either use a single effect of that spell slot or multiple effect from lower slots as indicated on the chart.

Having played with this spell casting variant before, I would advise the following for smooth game play and spell creation:
1- Each Word known has a note card.
2- Each card has some sort of visible indication to which component it belongs to and somewhere largely indicate minimum spell level. (I used different colored highlighters.)
3- On the card, leave space for both the variable formula(s) as well as the current result of said formula. (IE. 1d6/caster lvl | 3d6)
4- Place all the cards together on the table for the current spell being cast so they can be seen. Helps both the player to properly design the spell as well as helps you make sure there is less cheating (Either intentionally or accidentally.)
5- Play a spontaneous spell caster. The versatility of just being able to pick the Target component that bests suits the situation is where this variant spell casting shines.
6- While you can replicate a large portion of spells in the players handbook, there are spells that are too complex, niche, etc to do so. Either you & your player need to sit down and create Words fit these holes and/or allow the cast the spell as is in the source book.

After the first time I played with this system, I associated each spell Word with one of the runes from Diablo 2. So instead of saying I cast a 2nd lvl Careful [no somatic component] Burst [short range; 10ft radius] Frost Fingers [2d6 cold + 1 round staggered if save failed] I might have said Tal-Um-Mal. With the cards being used on the table for all to see and having given the DM a list indicating what rune was associated with what Word (though he just looked at the cards instead) I added a bit of role playing to my spell casting. Though the DM did rule that it was easier for those who have repeatedly heard a Word component to spellcraft the spell as a whole.

 

[TBeholder]

I understand that this idea is inherently unbalanced, because it essentially gives him access to every spell in every book ever published, and if I'm not careful, he will munchkin the crap out of it. But I kind of like the idea because it gives him the freedom to think creatively and also gives me the chance to exercise my own judgement as a GM to keep things entertaining and fair for everyone. Plus hopefully the dice will keep everything relatively kosher.

So despite my better judgement, I'm gonna work with him to allow this to be a thing. I was just curious if there was ever a time in your experience as a GM where you, against your better judgement, made a decision that you knew was probably a bad idea. Did it work out in the end, or did you end up regretting it?

You'll laugh, there are two very similar things in AD&D2.
1. Sha'ir from Al-Qadim has unlimited spell procurement. His gen familiar can fetch any spell Sha'ir have seen cast personally or existence of which is "common knowledge", unlimited times/day, but only one at a time and with at least 10% failure chance, depending on his level, spell level, and some other things. Base time is 1d6+spell level rounds (if he could cast this spell as a normal wizard), turns (if couldn't) or hours (if it's foreign or priestly magic), and there are possible problems if he goes for divine spells. Or his gen familiar may simply get lost for a while. Speaking of whom, he'd better treat his gen well.
2. Nahal's Reckless Dweomer. It's wild magic, of course. Allows to shape any spell the wizard personally knows. It automatically generates a wild surge - if the result mentions the cast spell (such as "spell works, AoE is doubled, if any", or "spell is deflected to the random target in range"), it goes off, otherwise he just caused a wild surge, and that's it.

There are 3.x conversions for both - Wild Mage in Complete Arcane, Sha'ir in Dragon #315 (and Dragon Compendium).