AoW - The Bronzewood Lodge Group(full) - OOC

jkason

First Post
Speaking of archaeologists, as we are in the IC thread, I'm vaguely drawn to the Archaeologist bard archetype from Ultimate Combat. A combination of scientist and performer seems rather flavorfully fitting for the circus-performer-turned-engineer that Tac is.

Mind you, it would be a fairly significant re-build, though, with Tac suddenly gaining spell abilities and losing his sneak attack, and I'm not sure he wouldn't be less rather than more effective (for example, he gets the trapfinding bonus, but doesn't have DD as a class skill). Just curious what others think of the archetype (and obviously what HM thinks about that kind of overhaul, probably would happen at the level 2 level up to avoid slowing everyone else down).
 

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jackslate45

First Post
As soon as I read UC, I made Harrison Jones, archeologist extrodinare. He specialized with a whip, and tripped up anyone who dared hurt him on his find. I really enjoy the feel of it as well. losing Inspire courage hurts, but having Loremaster makes up for it.

On a more serious note, my biggest concern is the lack of knowledges in he group. We have rolled extremely well, but Glimnock/Dorian are not specialized smart guys. I feel I would match your design better. Besides, have you actually SA anything yet?
 

jkason

First Post
As soon as I read UC, I made Harrison Jones, archeologist extrodinare. He specialized with a whip, and tripped up anyone who dared hurt him on his find. I really enjoy the feel of it as well. losing Inspire courage hurts, but having Loremaster makes up for it.

On a more serious note, my biggest concern is the lack of knowledges in he group. We have rolled extremely well, but Glimnock/Dorian are not specialized smart guys. I feel I would match your design better. Besides, have you actually SA anything yet?

I don't think I have, though I could be wrong. I just figured losing both the potential for SA from rogue and the ability to buff from bard might make him seem a bit of deadweight in combat, though I'm not sure he's done an amazing amount as it is. I mean, he set off the only trap we've so far found. :)

I have some milder concerns about having too much of a primary ability spread: dex (disable device), wis (perception), int (knowledges), and cha (spellcasting and luck duration) would all be important, which is a pretty wide spread.
 

HolyMan

Thy wounds are healed!
So you wish Bard to become your Favored class and switch to Archaeologist instead of taking it at level 2? (Thus being a Rogue1/Bard1)

The class is alright really just a rogue switching spellcasting for backstabbing.

The knowledge help would be a good thing everyone has their specialty, but not all the bases are covered. I like the 2nd lvl ability Clever Explorer...

gain "can disable intricate and complex devices in half the normal amount of time" meaning he probably learned this after the wind trap taught him that sometimes slow is not the way to go. :p

I am for you working in the class and then switching...

please make a note of all the changes that would take effect without making them just yet and let's see what becomes of good 'ol Tac.

HM
 

HolyMan

Thy wounds are healed!
Searching for a PrC for someboady else I found this. Why would they make the Archaelogist and Delver so silmilar.

What happens if you took this PrC?!? :erm:

HM
 

jkason

First Post
So you wish Bard to become your Favored class and switch to Archaeologist instead of taking it at level 2? (Thus being a Rogue1/Bard1)

Exactly. I have reservations about the general utility of the archetype in general; taking it as a non-favored multi-class definitely wouldn't be worth it from my perspective.

I am for you working in the class and then switching...

Cool. I actually had a vague idea that might make it work in-game: since we're in an odd, mystical tomb, Tac could wind up picking up a random 'strange object' that's caught his attention. Enter bright lights, odd sounds, and Tac finding himself 'transformed,' gaining the spellcasting / luck abilities after the light show and the artifact going inert.

please make a note of all the changes that would take effect without making them just yet and let's see what becomes of good 'ol Tac.

I'll start working something up. Thanks. :)

Searching for a PrC for someboady else I found this. Why would they make the Archaelogist and Delver so silmilar.

What happens if you took this PrC?!? :erm:

I remember reading somewhere that the PF game design philosophy was to try to replace PrC with archetypes. They wanted to encourage playing through the full class and also had an issue with PrC because they required a player to slog through X levels of random prereqs to get to the character they actually wanted.

My guess is that Archaeologist is their way of turning a PrC they like into an archetype to fit that philosophy. At least, that's my best guess. :)
 

Gondsman

Explorer
you know i've never been interrested in PrC's because I'd sacrifice so much of the base class. The only thing that ever attracted me to the PrC's was the occasional amazing class feature you couldn't get anywhere else. The Order of the Bow Initiate in 3.5e had a class ability that let you fire a bow in close combat with no AoO's that was the only reason i was interested in it.

Personally i'm a fan of the idea of being able to insert the flavor of the PrC's at L1 because that really is the way people want to play. If i want a Drunken Master, i don't want to have to Generic Monk for 10 levels, i want to start as a Drunken Apprentice, to Journeyman, to Master.

At the same time, sometimes you want to play Generic Class and then you get to the mid levels when most people are qualifying for PrC's and you want to go a new direction and add flavor, and the PrC makes better sense.
 

jkason

First Post
Okay, here's my first pass on Tac the Archaeologist Bard. I threw the 'odd artifact' bit into his background, though I can always excise it. The short list of changes:

Abilities: shuffled a few points from Int to Cha

Feats: Swapped out Weapon Finesse for Point Blank Shot. I figure as a caster now, he's more likely to try to stick to range. I'm debating dropping Dodge for Rapid Shot, but I'm always nervous about AC.

Traits: Swapped out both of them, actually. Mathematical Prodigy isn't necessary since Engineering's now a class skill for him. Replaced that with a trait that fixes the Disable Device-as-non-class problem, instead. Since the fluff for the change was also basically "ancient knowledge downloaded into his brain," I was also thinking Theoretical Magician might be a neat trait.

Skills: Shuffled around again. Fewer physical skills traded in for a smattering of Know skills. Again, fits the fluff as well as the strengths of the new class.

Spells: well, he has them now. :) With a subpar casting stat, it seemed best to try to take utility / buffing spells rather than anything that would grant a saving throw, since his save DC's will be pretty low.

Equipment: just added a component pouch. Maybe that's what the artifact is after it finishes working its mojo on Tac?

Also, made a call on the Archaeologist's Luck ability. The description doesn't include the "+2 per level after 1" wording that bardic performance does, but I read the "counts as bardic performance for effects, abilities, feats..." as meaning they intend it to work the same way with the exception of having specific performance types. The bonus scales just like Inspire Courage, as well, so it's not like it's an auto-win ability that needs a duration nerf.

[sblock=Tac Abor]
[sblock=Game Info]
Race: Human
Class: Bard (Archaeologist)
Level: 2
Hero Points: 1
Alignment: Neutral
Languages: Common, Draconic (int bonus)
Deity:None[/sblock]
[sblock=Abilities]
STR: 10 +0
DEX: 18 +4
CON: 10
INT: 12 +1
WIS: 16 +3
CHA: 13 +1[/sblock]
[sblock=Combat]
HP: 16 = [2d8 + 0] + 2 (favored class bonus)
AC: 17 = 10 + 2 (armor) + 4 (DEX) +1 (Dodge)
AC Touch: 15 = 10 + 4 (DEX) +1 (Dodge)
AC Flatfooted: 12 = 10 + 2 (armor) (* only flatfooted immobilized/ feinted)
INIT: +4 = +4 (DEX)
BAB: +1 = +1 (Bard)
CMB: +1 = +0 (STR) + 1 (BAB)
CMD: 15 = 10 + 0 (STR) + 4 (DEX) + 1 (BAB)
Fort: +0 = +0 (base) + 0 (Con)
Reflex: +7 = +3 (base) + 4 (Dex)
Will: +6 = +3 (base) + 3 (Wis)
Speed: 30'
Damage Reduction: N/A
Spell Resistance: N/A[/sblock]
[sblock=Weapon Stats]
Rapier (melee): +4 = +0 (BAB) + 4 (DEX) (finesse weapon)/ DMG = 1d6(P), CRIT 18-20x2
Shortbow (ranged): +4 = +0 (BAB) +4 (DEX) / DMG = 1d6(P), CRIT x3, range 60 ft.*

* +1 Attack & Damage within 30' (Point Blank Shot)
[/sblock]
[sblock=Racial Abilities]
* +2 ability of choice (Dex)
* Bonus feat
* Bonus skill point ea. level
* Choose favored class (Bard) [/sblock]
[sblock=Class Features]
* Bardic Knowledge: +1/2 level to all Know checks, make Know checks untrained
* Archaeologist's Luck: +1 luck to attack, save, skill, and damage
~Counts as bardic performance for feats
~Use 7 rounds / day (4 + 1 CHA base, **+2 Bard level beyond 1**)
* Clever Explorer:
~+1/2 bard level to Perception and Disable Device
~Disable at double speed
~Open Lock as standard action
* Simple weapon proficiency
* Proficiency: longsword, rapier, sap, short sword, shortbow, whip
* Light armor proficiency (no spell failure in light armor)
* Bard Spells:
Known: 5/3
Per day: unlimited/3
* Uncanny Dodge[/sblock]
[sblock=Feats & Traits]
Feats:
* Point Blank Shot (+1 attack / damage in 30' range) (1st level)
* Dodge (+1 AC when not flat-footed) (human bonus)
* Simple weapon proficiency (Bard)
* Proficiency: longsword, rapier, sap, short sword, shortbow, whip (Bard)
* Light armor proficiency (Bard)

Traits:
a) Nimble Fingers, Keen Mind (+1 Disable Device, and DD is a class skill)
b) Dangerously Curious (+1 UMD) OR Theoretical Magician (+2 Spellcraft)[/sblock]

[sblock=Skills]

Skill Points: 16
Max Ranks: 2
ACP: 0

Skill List:
Acrobatics +9 = +2 [ranks] +3 [class skill] +4 [DEX]
Disable Device +18 = +2 [ranks] +3 [class skill] +4 [DEX] +1 [Clever Explorer] +1 [Trait] +2 [MW tools] +5 [goggles of minute seeing]
Escape Artist +9 = +2 [ranks] +3 [class skill] +4 [DEX]
Knowledge (Dngnrng) +6 = +1 [ranks] +3 [class skill] +1 [INT] +1 [Bardic Knowledge]
Knowledge (Engnrng) +6 = +1 [ranks] +3 [class skill] +1 [INT] +1 [Bardic Knowledge]
Knowledge (History) +6 = +1 [ranks] +3 [class skill] +1 [INT] +1 [Bardic Knowledge]
Knowledge (Local) +6 = +1 [ranks] +3 [class skill] +1 [INT] +1 [Bardic Knowledge]
Knowledge (Planes) +6 = +1 [ranks] +3 [class skill] +1 [INT] +1 [Bardic Knowledge]
Knowledge (all others) +2 = +1 [INT] +1 [Bardic Knowledge

Perception +9 = +2 [ranks] +3 [class skill] +3 [WIS] +1 [Clever Explorer]
Stealth +9 = +2 [ranks] +3 [class skill] +4 [DEX]

[/sblock]

[sblock=Spells Known]Cantrips (DC 11): Dancing Lights, Mage Hand, Mending, Message, Prestidigitation
1st level (3/day, DC 12): Identify, Silent Image, Timely Intervention[/sblock]
[sblock=Equipment]

Wealth Roll
Code:
Equipment                    Cost  Weight
--Worn / Carried--
Leather armor        10gp   15lb
Rapier                       20gp    2lb
Shortbow                     30gp    2lb
Arrows(20)                    1gp    3lb
MW Backpack                  50gp    2lb
Signal Whistle                8sp
Explorer's outfit             --     --
Goggles of MS
Spell Component pouch         5gp    2

--In Backpack--
MW Thieves Tools            100gp    1lb
Chalk (5)                     5cp
Flint & Steel                 1gp
Ink (1 oz.)                   8gp 
Inkpen                        1sp 
Parchment (4)                 8sp 
Trail rations (2)             1gp    2lb
Waterskin                     1gp    4lb
Sunrod (2)                    4gp    2lb
Tindertwig (2)                2gp 

Buy in for CLW wand: 187 gp, 5 sp
Treasure: 0pp 27gp 5sp 0cpGems:
Total weight carried: 35lbs
Maximum weight possible:* 38(light) 76(medium) 115(heavy) 230(lift) 575(drag/push)
* MW Backpack: +1 str for figuring carrying capacity[/sblock]
[sblock=Details]
Size: Medium
Gender: Male
Age: 17
Height: 5'10"
Weight: 190lb
Hair Color: Green
Eye Color: Black
Skin Color: Olive
Appearance: Tac still sports the acrobat's build he developed in his youth: lean muscle and a light step. After too many nights trying and failing to get out all the mine dust, he's cropped his hair short, but his clothes are still always just a bit disheveled, usually from his rush to get to whatever project currently has his attention.
[sblock=Sketch]
TacInks.jpg
[/sblock]
Demenor: Generally good-natured, Tac is given to lengthy asides on topics that interest him but which he isn't always quick to realize bore others. He's also often distracted when he sees something that gets his engineering gears working. [/sblock]
[sblock=Background]Tac had the life most town children dreamed of, growing up as part of a traveling gypsy circus. He was tumbling before he learned to walk, and walking a rope not long after. Jugglers, contortionists, clowns, trapeze artists, all of them family, all eager to teach the young boy.

But while Tac was a good student, in truth he'd much rather have been measuring the gauge and tension on a rope than walking it; calculating the perfect weight distribution for juggling pins than tossing them. He contented himself playing clan handyman, fixing what needed fixing, dismantling mechanisms whenever possible to see how they were made. And finally, when he was twelve, he convinced his family to let him travel to the engineering guildhall.

As an apprentice, Tac did quite well. His mind's mathematical bent made his coursework a joy rather than a burden. And his acrobatic early life made his hands-on training easier, as--after tight ropes and balance beams--scaffolding was nothing more than another kind of staircase. His ability to act as both an architect and a crewman made Tac ideal for the hands-on work of re-securing the mine in Diamond Lake, shoring it up after a disastrous collapse.

Recently, while exploring the ancient tomb outside town, Tac came into contact with an odd artifact which imbued him with a large parcel of knowledge it apparently carried, including the ability to cast spells. The change seems to have overwritten some of the knowledge and abilities he once possessed, though since the artifact apparently used up its magics in the process, it appears he has no way to reverse the process.[/sblock] [/sblock]
 

jkason

First Post
And, because I got inspired by the whole "transformative moment," and the new colorful armor, more fun with sketchy-coloring. :)

[sblock=Tac Transformed]
TacAbor.jpg
[/sblock]
 

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