Yes, by design, as simple plans are less prone to disruption, whether through bad luck or meddling heroes.
I'm a fairly uncomplicated thinker. The heaviest plan I can come up with in short order is:
Objective: Overthrow the king and take his place.
Overthrow method: Encourage noble house A to assassinate king.
Encouragement method: Cause king to enact laws unfavorable to noble house A.
Replace method: Ingratiate self with peasants.
Ingratiation method: Host regular feasts free to all.
That's a plan that could easily take an hour for discussion(what laws, how do we stop noble house A from getting political allies, where does the food come from, what is the timing on all of these measures, etc.). It sums up in 5 bullet points, which is two castings for a competent 18th level ritual caster.
Can you provide a specific plan, either in bullet points as above or in essay format, which is sufficiently sophisticated that the parts the PCs need cannot be summarized down to 6 brief phrases? I say 6 because that's what a ritual caster choosing between View Object and Consult Oracle can expect to get for about the same expenditure as View Object.
A full hour isn't necessary. All I desire is a plan for which 6 bullet points is insufficient to provide the PCs with a broad overview and one or two likely options for appropriate action.Can I write out a plan long enough that it would take a large fraction of an hour to present even in condensed form? Yes, certainly.
I never asked for an extended creative-writing project. I don't need a creative new plan, a boring old one would be great. If they show up often enough in campaigns for the longer scry duration to be necessary, someone must have already seen one.Will I engage in an extended creative-writing project simply for the sake of discussing the shortcomings of short-duration scrying spells? Hmm, let me think... no.
I can accept the possibility that such plans might exist. I can also accept the possibility that such plans might not exist. Until I get some evidence, however, I cannot take either possibility as actual truth. Given that scry durations being too short would warrant the creation of a house rule, burden of proof falls to the claims of the existence of such plans.You yourself may favour more straightforward plans for your villains, but I refuse to believe that you lack the imagination to conceive of villains in other campaigns having more complex and involved plans.
The Issue with the short duration isn't that you can't learn what you need in the alloted time. The problem is instead that assuming that a 30 second maximum viewing time (remember you could get less depending on your roll) can be timed accurately enough to see what you want breaks supencion of disbelief. Then add to that the redicilous ratio of an hure of setup for 30 seconds of payout and you have further problems. Essentially the problem is not with the ritual as a plot device but as a feasable addition to the game world.
Can someone, anyone, provide me with a scenario in which an hour-long scry is uniquely informative?
Will I engage in an extended creative-writing project simply for the sake of discussing the shortcomings of short-duration scrying spells? Hmm, let me think... no.
I can accept the possibility that such plans might exist. I can also accept the possibility that such plans might not exist. Until I get some evidence, however, I cannot take either possibility as actual truth. Given that scry durations being too short would warrant the creation of a house rule, burden of proof falls to the claims of the existence of such plans.
The reason I've been asking for specific examples is that one of the most straightforward ways to prove something can exist is to create or identify an example of it. I would happily accept other proofs, should those be easier to provide.
I like this, but I'm not sure why Consult Oracle fails. What does the oracle say in response to the questions "why was this person charged with this crime" or "why was this person found guilty"? These are both valid questions to put to the oracles.One thought I had would be in a scenario where one of the PCs or a NPC dear to the group was placed on trial (for any reason, lets say its a corrupt judicial system).
The PCs are generally based and friends of the kingdom in question so would not aggressively act against its people nor would they try and sneak into a well guarded courtroom/jury room.
Scry would allow them to 'listen in' to the Jury or the Judge and perhaps uncover that its all a setup to manipulate the PCs and that their friend will be executed after being certain to be found guilty.
This point it gives the PCs the information that they would not normally get (Oracle might give the verdict but not the motives behind it) plus players would legitimately know when to use the Scry because there would be a specific time the jurors would be deliberating.
Not sure you would be able to pull that info in 18 seconds rather than one hour.