D&D 5E Can mundane classes have a resource which powers abilities?

[Ahnehnois]

The resources are a means to an end.

It's a matter of figuring out if the end result is worth the overhead.

True, to a great extent. What the 3.5 warlock showed me was that spell slots were not really necessary for spellcasters. I'm pretty skeptical that spell slots are then worthwhile for non-spellcasters.

I mean, I could absolutely see a fatigue-based system where every round spent in melee brings you closer to passing out whether you get hit or not, regardless of your class (and then throw in various class-based advantages). But is it worth tracking? I'm skeptical.

 

[Ahnehnois]

I've yet to have the fighter in my group become confused on whether or not he's rested since he last used Action Surge.

It's really not that hard.
Keeping track of how many arrows you've shot is harder.

I'm not saying that it's too hard; I'm saying that it's wasted effort.

 

[Jacob Marley]

I mean, I could absolutely see a fatigue-based system where every round spent in melee brings you closer to passing out whether you get hit or not, regardless of your class (and then throw in various class-based advantages). But is it worth tracking? I'm skeptical.

For a fatigue-based system to generally model human endurance -- let alone dwarven endurance! -- we would need to reexamine how much time a round represents, or substantially increase the number of rounds a combat lasts. A character falling unconscious after 5 rounds of combat really strains my credulity if those rounds are as short of a time frame as D&D traditionally has been (6 seconds to 1 minute per round).

 

[The Crimson Binome]

So it sounds like there is some consensus that it's okay to have a martial class that uses a resource, as long as it makes sense within the narrative, and doesn't involve any out-of-game influence; and as long as the no-resource fighter is still available and viable for those who want it.

So what kind of resource works? Short-term (encounter-based) rage or energy don't work because combat is too fast, so it needs to reset with either a short rest or long rest.

Personally, I'm a fan of fatigue. Is the fatigued condition still around? If so, then you can make a fighter's second wind clear that condition. Maybe you have certain maneuvers that cause fatigue - not with points, but just as a binary yes/no you are fatigued or not fatigued. The fighter, with the second wind ability that represents their ability to keep going, would be the only ones who could use more than one of those maneuvers per encounter.

 

[Dausuul]

Do you think the D&D audience will accept a mundane (non-magical) class which has a resource that powers abilities?

If yes, will the D&D audience accept a resource which is unique to that class?

Of course. We have a couple of examples already--barbarian rage* and the superiority dice that Weaponmaster fighters get.

[size=-2]*Admittedly, rage only powers one ability at the moment. But I can easily imagine feats or class abilities that would let you burn "charges" of rage for other purposes.[/size]

 

[Ashkelon]

So I created a 5e version of the Warblade that uses a resource that is unlimited, but not usable at-will. It can be found here: http://community.wizards.com/forum/dd-next-general-discussion/threads/4058286

D&D is filled with examples of limited resources for non-magical characters. Even in AD&D there are fighter kits and other martial classes with daily abilities. In 3e there were feats, rogue tricks, barbarian rages, and many prestige classes that granted daily abilities.

I personally dislike "daily" abilities in general so they never really worked for me, but limited resources like that have existed in D&D for a long time.

I like the way 13th Age handles limited use abilities for fighters and rogues with random trigger abilities and momentum. The rogue's momentum abilities, if ported over, would make for a very interesting 5e rogue.

I also used a variant in 4e that made "powers" a little more believable. Instead of daily and encounter powers, you received 3 red poker chips and 3 black poker chips. When you use an "encounter" power, you have to spend a red poker chip. When you use a "daily" power, you have to spend a black poker chip. You can use the same power multiple times per encounter or day. A short rest recovers all your red poker chips and an extended rest recovers all your black poker chips.

Whenever you reach a milestone, you can choose to regain 3 surges, a black poker chip, or an action point. Milestones were given out by the DM, not every 2 encounters.

 

[Grydan]

If people want to play superhero games there are plenty out there. Why does D&D need to become one?

So the fighter being able to exhaust their ability to do their more difficult manoeuvres, rather than being an untiring juggernaut who can attack at full strength continuously, makes them more like a superhero?

Interesting.

 

[Wulfgar76]

So the fighter being able to exhaust their ability to do their more difficult manoeuvres, rather than being an untiring juggernaut who can attack at full strength continuously, makes them more like a superhero?

Interesting.

I don't get it either. In boxing, MMA, or any sort of hand-to-hand combat, a fighter can choose to make an explosive burst of effort to beat his opponent. The tradeoff - he's tired after doing it.

 

[Ahnehnois]

I don't get it either. In boxing, MMA, or any sort of hand-to-hand combat, a fighter can choose to make an explosive burst of effort to beat his opponent. The tradeoff - he's tired after doing it.

That isn't a special resource that powers abilities, though. That's just hit points. In D&D terms, the fighter is simply damaging himself in order to produce extra effort. Show me that cleanly implemented for D&D and I'll sing its praises.

I have a feeling some people would complain about "death spirals" or somesuch if bursts of effort imposed actual penalties on the character making the effort.

 

[EnglishLanguage]

Meh, Wizards are already superheroes by level 5, I don't see the issue with the Fighter also being one.