Casting Multiple spells in the First Round- Options?

[Herzog]

In case of a single opponent:
Time Hop (psionic power) : Get rid of your opponent for a few rounds, so ALL your party buffers can get in a few buff and/or summoning spells spells.
Also: combines with most other abovementioned options....
(except those that actually try to attack the opponent, of course, since he's not here right now....)

 

[James the Newbie]

http://dndtools.eu/spells/players-handbook-v35--6/forcecage--2617/

Certainly if caught alone, or with three allies force cage is useful, as you can trap yourself s in it, buff up, and dispel it. Its a bit of a pain to break force spells after all

Another option is make your first spell fog cloud or anything else that grants concealment around the whole area. (Granted worthless to aoe)

Or combine the two, make a fog cloud, then quicken (or any other method of getting off your 2nd spell) a force cage that they cant see, so they wouldn't have the for thought to break both defenses in one round.

Rather than focusing on getting the action's in time, think of methods (I am sure you have more than I do) of cutting yourself off from the world for a few rounds before they get to you

Prismatic Sphere is probably an extream example of this idea in fact, though a 'tad' out of most players reach.

Granting your whole group flight stops most attacks, though that's just an 'easy button' any way.

 

[Drowbane]

Dimension Swap on some of your foes with an Anticipate Teleport (preferably Greater) up. Also good for saving the bacon of your party tank when he is very low and you might want to fireball that area.

edit: I am away from my Spell Compendium, dimension swap may not be the spell I am thinking of. Dimension Hop? Baleful Transposition? Something like that...

 

[Empirate]

Forcecage – Spell – D&D Tools

Certainly if caught alone, or with three allies force cage is useful, as you can trap yourself s in it, buff up, and dispel it. Its a bit of a pain to break force spells after all

Another option is make your first spell fog cloud or anything else that grants concealment around the whole area. (Granted worthless to aoe)

Or combine the two, make a fog cloud, then quicken (or any other method of getting off your 2nd spell) a force cage that they cant see, so they wouldn't have the for thought to break both defenses in one round.

Rather than focusing on getting the action's in time, think of methods (I am sure you have more than I do) of cutting yourself off from the world for a few rounds before they get to you

Prismatic Sphere is probably an extream example of this idea in fact, though a 'tad' out of most players reach.

Granting your whole group flight stops most attacks, though that's just an 'easy button' any way.

Some problems with that:

1. While you take your time buffing, the enemy is free to do the same (or whatever else they please),

2. Not being seen due to Fog Cloud, while often advantageous, also means you can't see a damn thing yourself,

3. More generally, cutting yourself off from the world means you're cut off from your opponents, leaving them free to do what they please (wander away to come back later when your buffs have run out? Assume tactically advantageous positions and ready actions? Your guess is as good as mine). This cutting off thing cuts both ways,

4. Forcecage is the most overrated spell ever. Did you know it costs 1,500 gp to cast? Strictly a last resort in my book! Unless you can get it as a spell-like,

5. Flight is only a solution in some encounters. From the mid levels onwards, most opponents will have a way of dealing with that. Flight is great, don't get me wrong, but it's hardly an 'easy' button. It's more that it's mandatory to be able to meet flying opponents' terms.

 

[James the Newbie]

Some problems with that:

1. While you take your time buffing, the enemy is free to do the same (or whatever else they please),

2. Not being seen due to Fog Cloud, while often advantageous, also means you can't see a damn thing yourself,

3. More generally, cutting yourself off from the world means you're cut off from your opponents, leaving them free to do what they please (wander away to come back later when your buffs have run out? Assume tactically advantageous positions and ready actions? Your guess is as good as mine). This cutting off thing cuts both ways,

4. Forcecage is the most overrated spell ever. Did you know it costs 1,500 gp to cast? Strictly a last resort in my book! Unless you can get it as a spell-like,

5. Flight is only a solution in some encounters. From the mid levels onwards, most opponents will have a way of dealing with that. Flight is great, don't get me wrong, but it's hardly an 'easy' button. It's more that it's mandatory to be able to meet flying opponents' terms.

Point 1 I think your right, but only 50% of the time, because if you have been caught off guard, the enemies have most likely snuck up on you and buffed up. So unless you stumble into each other this is not always true

Point 2 If your enemies can deal more damage or hit easier then its more useful to you while you buff, as you can take a full round action to make 6 touch attempts. But your right, especially if your opponent has something like say tremor sense, this is certainly not the best idea.

Point 3 is similar to point one, and I agree that cutting yourself off gives your (I assume pre buffed) enemies a similar advantage. I will add that most enemies you stumble into will be less likly to have a mage and more likly be wandering creatures.

Point 4 I read that, I was just using it as an example, but yes its not the best solution

Point 5 I agree that some of the time it is necesary, but other times is becomes 'an easy button.

----
This did raise the idea that a high spot check helps give you 1-2 rounds before your enemy get there, if you don't mean totally ambushed as in within about 30 feet of you in their surprise round.
That lets you get off up to six spells, since you can only take one swift action and one standard action I think? Unless you can cast a standard, swift and quickened spell (since quickened is free) for 3 spells a round? I don't know if that works

Empirate's point that cutting yourself off from the enemy can give them an advantage stands, but it still looks appealing if they are buffed and you are not.

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

This did raise the idea that a high spot check helps give you 1-2 rounds before your enemy get there, if you don't mean totally ambushed as in within about 30 feet of you in their surprise round.
That lets you get off up to six spells, since you can only take one swift action and one standard action I think? Unless you can cast a standard, swift and quickened spell (since quickened is free) for 3 spells a round? I don't know if that works

Empirate's point that cutting yourself off from the enemy can give them an advantage stands, but it still looks appealing if they are buffed and you are not.

I agree a high spot check would mitigate the scenario I proposed, but the purpose of my original post was to maximize efficiency of the first round so as to spend the rest of the encounter pummeling your enemies and shortening the number of overall rounds needed for combat. I've wanted to weep when it's round 4 and the Cleric is still casting buffs, and other situations like these.

However, James the Newbie, I do appreciate your spin on my question, changing it to "What sorts of things can we do to keep us safe after combat has initiated so as to be prepared?" This is outside the intention of my original post, but still worth keeping in mind as a Party says, "What can we do to survive/win?"

 

[James the Newbie]

There is a feat (Page 62 of sword and fist)

Called multitasking, you need at least four arms, although there are ways and means of making yourself just about any shape you need.

Multitasking – Feat – D&D Tools

If you can activate separate items then you can activate separate buffs... but if your dm intemperate it as you can perform multiple spells, well then, you may just be one of the most terrifying spell casters out there.

Afterall it reads 'casting a spell with two other arms' and 'Thus, you could attack with one or two arm' so casting two spells, within the limit. Although verbal components would have to be accounted for.

This said one spell one magic item, you still get an extra spell.

 

[Lactantius]

- Simbuls Spell Matrix / Sequencer / Triggerr can store a spell and cast it later as free action; depending on th spell version you use, it can allow a pool of 1 till 4 spells (compare MoF vs. PGtF vs SpC)

- Raising an Veil as Io7V as immediate action: that should give you time and hold off enemies. Furthermore, it protects against a certain threat (which you just realised) like arrow, magical rays, fogs, dragon breath

- Items that grant swift actions for your spells like circlet of rapid casting

- Shadow Cloak (DotU) grants immediate dimension step which is useful enough in ambush situations

- found in an older 3.0 supplement (Tome and Blood): chain contingency. It is level 9 and works like contingency, but with 3 (other) spells. That means:
1) it stacks with normal contingency, so you can have 4 contingent spells; 2) all 3 spells come to effect under 1 common condition; 3) you can choose to let the contigent spells come into effect either simultaenously or one per round.
Maybe this spell is too powerful. That could tell why WotC never updated this spell in 3.5 (there is only one 9th-level-contingency-equivalent called instant refuge, a successor of the FR-spell Elminsters Evasion) =)

 

[irdeggman]

There is a feat (Page 62 of sword and fist)

Called multitasking, you need at least four arms, although there are ways and means of making yourself just about any shape you need.

Multitasking – Feat – D&D Tools

If you can activate separate items then you can activate separate buffs... but if your dm intemperate it as you can perform multiple spells, well then, you may just be one of the most terrifying spell casters out there.

Afterall it reads 'casting a spell with two other arms' and 'Thus, you could attack with one or two arm' so casting two spells, within the limit. Although verbal components would have to be accounted for.

This said one spell one magic item, you still get an extra spell.

You need to be real careful about using 3.0 and 3.5 material together.

3.5 has defined actions differently and introduced: swift and immediate actions. 3.0 only had "free" actions.

Also I don't see how it is possible to use "multiple partial actions" to make multiple "standard actions", which is the action required for almost all spells and magic item activations.

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

Everyone is presenting great suggestions, thanks! Keep them coming!

There is a feat (Page 62 of sword and fist)

Called multitasking...

Awesome, never heard of this, prereqs look heavy, but definitely in the spirit of this thread.