Character Build: Dragon Disciple

[IcyCool]

At 10th level the DD gets full Half-Dragon benefits... without the LA. At least, I think so.

Bye
Thanee

Yep, including wings (regardless of size).

 

[pbd]

pbd what is the point of extending true strike?

Sorry, my bad, I though it gave +20 to all attacks for the next round. Does it show I don't play casters much?

 

[Scion]

Tank you say? Forget the DD and go Half-Dragon/Barb, Fighter, or Ranger. It's Core (MM) and WAY better in a fight with the increased STR and CON. Other bonuses, NAT Armor +4... jeez +4!!!... and a breath weapon that can actually come in handy on occasion.

I dont much care for either overall really

I think he'd be better off making a druid and going for dragon wildshape out of the draconomicon!

Sure it'll take awhile, but hey, long term goals are good right?

 

[Feldspar]

Starting Level: 5th (I'm aware 6th is earliest for DD, just need advice on routes generally).
Stats: 18, 18, 15, 13, 12, 10 (+1 floating point for 4th level - Yes he's a lucky roller).
Race: Flexible (Feel free to make suggestions for/against different races.
Sources: Core and Completes only please.
He said he's quite sceptical about their ability to tank because typically to get into the class you'd have to go via Bard or Sorcerer; not well known for their hitpoints or melee talents.

My current character is 5th level and about to go into Dragon Disciple. My plan is to make use of that increased strength to improve my tripping abilities. Trip is a pretty dang wicked move to pull in combat; +4 to hit while they're down, AoO provoking move equivalent to get up. The other melee combatants (Rogues, Clerics, etc) in the party love ya. Here's what I'd go with if I were you:

Barbarian 2 / Fighter 2 / Sorceror 1 / Dragon Disciple
Str 18 - this is your primary stat
Dex 15+1 - 4 AoO's with Combat Reflexes, +3 Dex perfect for Breastplate
Con 18 - sweet, sweet HP's
Int 13 - needed for Disarm
Wis 10
Cha 12 - you're only spellcasting to get into DD, you can neglect this

Race: human
Feats: Combat Reflexes, Combat Expertise, Improved Trip, Power Attack, _____
1st level Sorc spells:
True Strike (no Somatic means no ASF; combine it with Power Attack)
Enlarge Person (awesome spell for a tank, reach, size bonus on opposed checks, extra damage from larger weapon)

My DM doesn't allow Spiked Chains, and I'm also pretty sure that he won't allow me to threaten both 5' and 10' by combining a reach weapon with my natural weapons. But, if your DM will let you do that, that would be the way to go and you still have feat left over if you have to buy EWP: Spiked Chain or Two Weapon Fighting or something.

At fifth level, right now, while enlarged and raging you'd have a 24 str and bonus of +15 on opposed trip rolls against a medium sized creature - and you'll have reach. DD will end up giving another +4 on that trip roll by the time you reach the end.

Since the roll to start the trip attempt is just a touch roll, you can even afford to convert some or all of that "+4 to hit prone target" bonus into Power Attack damage and get more use out of that feat.

As for the future, once you get your wings you'll probably want to get the feat that bumps up your manueverability class by one category. That will let you hover which is a pretty big deal.

 

[Shadowdweller]

My DM doesn't allow Spiked Chains, and I'm also pretty sure that he won't allow me to threaten both 5' and 10' by combining a reach weapon with my natural weapons. But, if your DM will let you do that, that would be the way to go and you still have feat left over if you have to buy EWP: Spiked Chain or Two Weapon Fighting or something.

The DM will allow what the DM will allow. The thing is, natural weapons don't work quite like manufactured weapons....in this particular case, you've no need of TWF at all (that I can see, anyhow). You SHOULD technically be able to make a spiked chain attack and a bite attack with this combo in the same round....at no penalties to your iteratives (spiked chain) and a flat -5 from highest for your bite (or -2 if you have multiattack).

(Apologies if you knew this already. I've been wondering whether this was understood by everyone.)

 

[Thanee]

My current character is 5th level and about to go into Dragon Disciple.

Very similar to the Barbarian/.../Dragon Disciple who just died in our campaign.

Not that this means to foretell your fate or anything...

He had a ranger level instead of the 2nd barbarian level, though, and no Combat Reflexes, but EWP: Bastard Sword instead. And Cleave and Extra Rage later. Oh, and Shield instead of True Strike.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Feldspar]

Very similar to the Barbarian/.../Dragon Disciple who just died in our campaign.
Not that this means to foretell your fate or anything...

Oh, I'm quite sure he won't last long. We're in the WLD and have already had one party wipe, so he's my first replacement. I think one person might be on character number 4 - not sure though ...

He had a ranger level instead of the 2nd barbarian level

1st level? for the extra skill points? With the Sorc level in there, I like the extra d12 and Uncanny Dodge.

no Combat Reflexes

The best thing about Combat Reflexes, so far, has been that it allows you take attacks of opportunity even when flat footed. Combine this with Uncanny Dodge from that 2nd level of Barbarian and I'm perfectly happy walking point in front of the rest of the party with my Guisarme. When something surprises that party and charges you ... and you trip it before it can even get to you ... now that is sweet!

EWP: Bastard Sword instead. And Cleave and Extra Rage later. Oh, and Shield instead of True Strike.

That's ... odd. I wouldn't bother with a Bastard Sword unless I thought I might be using a shield - but then they also have the Shield spell. Just feels like there's some wasteage there due to redundancy. Also seems like with the high str that it would be advantageous to use two handed weapons as much as possible.

Very suprising to me not to have True Strike. Got tired of missing dark mantles due to concealment - started True Strike-Power Attacking them. That was fun. Miss a round (casting the spell), obliterate a dark mantle, repeat until out of dark mantles or daily allotment of spells

 

[Thanee]

Well, I didn't mean to say, that these changes would be better or recommendable... just what came to mind, where the character differed from yours.

He, indeed, used a shield (a buckler). No idea, why he had the Shield spell, I think he changed that from the initial Identify.

True Strike is definitely a good idea for such a character, as are some of the nice swift spell in Complete Adventurer, i.e. Critical Strike or Swift Expeditious Retreat.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Inconsequenti-AL]

Considered making one of these guys for the game I'm playing in atm.

Always worth noting that True Strike is a V/F spell... no spell failure for casting in armour. Full Plate all the way.

The DD gets nice Str boosts, but offsets their lowered BAB. If I wanted to play a fighter type, I'd definitely put one of those 18's into Strength... I'd put being able to hit stuff right up there on a fighters 'to do' list. I'd put the other one in Con, but that's just me.

Paladin 4/Sorceror 1/DD X is a very strong build in my opinion. Plenty of potential for interesting backgrounds.

Now a Gestalt Paladin/Sorceror > Sorceror/DD - that'd be 'interesting'.

 

[ARandomGod]

A dragon is terrifying.

That's just a weird-looking human, who breathes fire (or something else), that doesn't really do anything.

Using the breath weapon is just a waste of time, unfortunately. It might be good for posing.

Bye
Thanee

Hey, it's also good for killing off those distracting swarms, lighting the campfire at night, an emergency lighting of a torch, killing off that pesky fly that's been bugging you all day... a finishing touch on a regenerating monster. Once a day, of course, so really you'll bypass all sorts of useful things to do with that weapon, waiting for that better one that just never comes...