Class Compendium: Heroes of Legend

[Scribble]

How is this a justification for not updating the DC's in the eratta document? Nothing about the new DC's is dependent upon the new books being in the CB... especially since, unless I am recalling incorrectly, they are in the Compendium?

Not so much "justification" as explanation? Ie they do things in "chunks" kind of.

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[Imaro]

Not so much "justification" as explanation? Ie they do things in "chunks" kind of.

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Chunks of what? Like I said, some of the material made it into the updates... some of the material made it into the Compendium and some made it into the CB... Not sure what methodology was used to determine what went where since it's all mixed up.

 

[JoeGKushner]

So does anyone believe that WoTC is going to ever reprint the core PHB, DMG, and MM?

I can't imagine that with their new 'intro' line and the new books covering 'Essential' versions of those classes, that it will happen.

Do other people think it will?

 

[tuxgeo]

So does anyone believe that WoTC is going to ever reprint the core PHB, DMG, and MM?

I can't imagine that with their new 'intro' line and the new books covering 'Essential' versions of those classes, that it will happen.

Do other people think it will?

Sure - I'll go out on a limb and say that WotC will keep the core PHB, MM, and DMG in print until they announce 5E.

After all, why lose potential sales? If any potential player sees a roleplaying role model using the PHB, and decides to buy his or her own copy because of that, shouldn't the book remain in print for that potential customer to buy? (Why deliberately lose possible sales?)

 

[xechnao]

Sure - I'll go out on a limb and say that WotC will keep the core PHB, MM, and DMG in print until they announce 5E.

After all, why lose potential sales? If any potential player sees a roleplaying role model using the PHB, and decides to buy his or her own copy because of that, shouldn't the book remain in print for that potential customer to buy? (Why deliberately lose possible sales?)

Sales come with a cost. If the estimated cost is higher than the estimated sales revenue Wizards will deliberately not pursue to sell.

 

[Truename]

If I use the skill description from classic, I can identify Rituals but can't manipulate the qualities of one's magic, control outside magical phenomenon or use it instead of diplomacy (or to enhance diplomacy) with certain creatures...

While if I use essentials as my reference I can't identify rituals but can do all thew other stuff.

Huh what? Other than a few small changes, the rules for Arcana in the RC (pp.133-136) are identical to the rules for Arcana in the PHB (pp.181-182).

• Arcana Knowledge: Identical.

• Monster Knowledge: Identical except for DCs.

• Identify Conjuration or Zone: Identical except for DCs.

• Identify Ritual / Identify Magical Effect: Combined into a single "Identify Magical Phenomenon" block in the RC. RC also says you understand the effect/ritual's basic purpose and effects, which the PHB doesn't, but this is arguably just a better phrasing of RAI. Otherwise, they're identical except for DCs.

• Sense the Presence of Magic: Identical except for DCs and duration (reduced from 1 minute to standard action).

If you're referring to the "improvising" block, those are samples, not rules. Improv is up to your DM and always has been. Personally, I encourage my players to use their skills, including Arcana, for all kinds of cool stuff.

Improvisation Suggestions: In addition to providing rules... some skill descriptions include suggestions [which] include sample DCs... Skills are meant to be open-ended, and players and DMs are are encouraged to use them creatively... the DM sets the DCs [and] has the final say on what a skill's possible uses are.

The only significant change is to the DCs, which I embrace wholeheartedly. The old DCs were too hard, then too easy. The new ones finally get it right, and about time, too.

 

[Scribble]

Chunks of what? Like I said, some of the material made it into the updates... some of the material made it into the Compendium and some made it into the CB... Not sure what methodology was used to determine what went where since it's all mixed up.

Don't know- as I'm not part of WoTC's team that loads the updates...

All I know if that based on my own life in a corporate environment stuff gets done at what seems like a random pattern, but usually if you are a part of what's going on has some sort of explaination/method.

If you're looking for a reason to be angry though- go for it.

So does anyone believe that WoTC is going to ever reprint the core PHB, DMG, and MM?

I can't imagine that with their new 'intro' line and the new books covering 'Essential' versions of those classes, that it will happen.

Do other people think it will?

If there is demand for it then sure.

If not- who cares?

 

[TrainedMunkee]

So does anyone believe that WoTC is going to ever reprint the core PHB, DMG, and MM?

I can't imagine that with their new 'intro' line and the new books covering 'Essential' versions of those classes, that it will happen.

Do other people think it will?

I'm fairly sure they won't. Not good economics at this point, but that can change. They will continue to support 4E though, electronically if nothing else.

 

[Imaro]

Huh what? Other than a few small changes, the rules for Arcana in the RC (pp.133-136) are identical to the rules for Arcana in the PHB (pp.181-182).

• Arcana Knowledge: Identical.

• Monster Knowledge: Identical except for DCs.

• Identify Conjuration or Zone: Identical except for DCs.

• Identify Ritual / Identify Magical Effect: Combined into a single "Identify Magical Phenomenon" block in the RC. RC also says you understand the effect/ritual's basic purpose and effects, which the PHB doesn't, but this is arguably just a better phrasing of RAI. Otherwise, they're identical except for DCs.

• Sense the Presence of Magic: Identical except for DCs and duration (reduced from 1 minute to standard action).

If you're referring to the "improvising" block, those are samples, not rules. Improv is up to your DM and always has been. Personally, I encourage my players to use their skills, including Arcana, for all kinds of cool stuff.



The only significant change is to the DCs, which I embrace wholeheartedly. The old DCs were too hard, then too easy. The new ones finally get it right, and about time, too.

I already listed what the main differences were in how the skill was presented between RC and PHB... small differences? Yes. Still differences that will shape the expectations of players depending upon what source they use as their primary reference.

Now here's something funny... look at the Arcana skill as presented in RC and then look at it as presented in HotFL... Yeah, the HotFL presentation is missing parts, compared to the RC, as well... which I find odd since it is the player's book and they are the one's who will be using the skills, in most cases, more often than the DM will. Honestly I like essentials, it's gottebn meready to jumpback into 4e once our Gammma World game ties up... but the structure, re-printing of material betweeen them, and the niggling differences between some of these books is a little dissapointing when you start looking closely at them. Not dissapointing enough to stop me from purchasing them... but dissapointing nonetheless.

 

[Imaro]

Don't know- as I'm not part of WoTC's team that loads the updates...

All I know if that based on my own life in a corporate environment stuff gets done at what seems like a random pattern, but usually if you are a part of what's going on has some sort of explaination/method.

If you're looking for a reason to be angry though- go for it.

Who is angry? I don't think I've posted anything that should give you the impression that I am angry or mad about any of this. I am making observations, that's it...unless me choosing not to agree with your opinions and assertions = angry??

I think you're trying to find a way to assert that WotC plannned all of this to happen the way it did... instead of going with the simplest explanation... which is WotC didn't prepare well enough for the roll out of essentials, especially in conjunction with their classic products and electronic tools. As far as working in a corporation, I also work in corporate america, for an IT based company, and more often than not... being ill-prepared and/or mis-planned is what causes things to go awry...YMMV of course.