Constitution = hit points?

[Hammerforge]

Hey all,

I've been thinking of using an alternate system for hit points to create more of a realistic feel to my next campaign (D&D). Basically, I was thinking of making hit points equal to Constitution score + level. This way not only are hit points tied directly to one's physical toughness rather than an abstract number, but also characters' total hit points will be more realistic at higher levels.

The problem with this, though, is that as characters increase their levels, the hit points won't "keep up with" their other abilities that are increasing, such as BAB, etc. This would probably create a problem when deciding what monsters to have them face. In terms of their BAB, they could probably handle tougher monsters with a higher CR, but in terms of their hit points, they wouldn't be able to handle such challenging creatures. So it would always be tough to decide what challenges to throw at them.

I am reluctant to part with the Con = HP system because of the sense of realism it adds to the game, but I also recognize this conundrum would probably create an inconsistency in the game. Does anyone have any suggestions on ways to use this hit point system while still confronting the characters with highly challenging monsters? One idea I had was to allow the characters to add more than one hit point when they gain a level, something that would represent an average for their class (e.g., fighters would gain 5 hp per level, monks would gain 4, and so on). This would involve a compromise between the two systems, which might work pretty well.

Any thoughts or suggestions?

 

[Rodrigo Istalindir]

Check out one of the many WP/VP type systems out there. Those have been tweaked enough that you can get pretty much the exact effect you're looking for, with guidelines on how to change other rules (eg sneak attack) to match.

 

[Bront]

Is you use the system you have for Wound Points (which is a bit higher than the stock Con only) and normal HP for Vitality Points, you're good.

The system I've seen that is intriguing is that criticals do wound point damage, not vitality point damage, and are not doubled, trippled, or whatever. Instead, any multiplier above x2 increases the crit range by one, so a Longsword is already 19-20, but now so is a battleaxe. A scythe is now 17-20. You still need to confirm, but it makes a critical fairly deadly.

 

[Aust Diamondew]

If you make con=HP or even con+level=HP be prepared to see your party TPKed at around level 5 by the first NPC wizard that casts fireball. Realism to that extent has no place in a magical world, such as the typical D&D one.

If you make HP equal con+(level*class multiplier) then it won't be too much different than it is now, constitution will just matter more at low levels and less at high levels.
For Example:
Monk level 1 w/14 con will have 18 HP
At level 10 w/14 con he'll have 54 HP
And at 20 he'd have 94HP
The way things are now at level 1 he'd have 10HP, at level 10 68 HP and at level 20 133HP.

If you want a more realistic game and still have PCs face powerful monsters I don't think you really can.
However if you just want realism I recommend checking out Ken Hood's Grim and Gritty rules.

 

[Hammerforge]

If you want a more realistic game and still have PCs face powerful monsters I don't think you really can.
However if you just want realism I recommend checking out Ken Hood's Grim and Gritty rules.

Anyone know where I can get this? I'd be interested in checking it out.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

For a similar feel, try lowering the massive damage threshold from 50 to Con score, or Con score + HD.

I use Massive Damage Threshold = Con score, with a scaling Fortitude save DC based on how much the damage exceeded the MDT. (There are some exceptions for magic and sneak attack to make it deadly, but not genocidal.) So far, it works pretty well, though players seem a little more reluctant to enter combat without some kind of edge.

 

[Raigon]

I have a feeling that the con+level=hp system will imbalance the ability scores. By making hp so dependent on Constitution it will place a HUGE emphasis for characters to choose it as there highest score.

 

[Aus_Snow]

Anyone know where I can get this? I'd be interested in checking it out.

Sure.

http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=5022


By the way, when you say "realistic", what do you mean exactly?

 

[Menexenus]

I use it for negative hit points.

I use (Con Bonus + Level + 10) for the number of negative hit points you can receive before you are dead. So if you are a 5th level Barbarian with a 16 Con, you don't die at -10 hit points, you'd die at -18 hit points. I made this change because I found that at higher levels, stabilizing wounded comrades becomes a rarer and rarer phenomenon. If you stick with -10 as the point of death, as the opponents' damage increases, characters are more often killed outright than knocked out unless something is done to increase the range in which a character is dying. I'm sure many people have no problem with characters being killed outright, but I wanted to preserve the "dying" mechanic as much as possible even at higher levels for dramatic effect. (I find that it is much more dramatically interesting for a 12th level character to be dying on the floor in need of help from their comrades after the dragon breathes on him rather than to be simply dead.) YMMV

 

[Hammerforge]

For a similar feel, try lowering the massive damage threshold from 50 to Con score, or Con score + HD.

I use Massive Damage Threshold = Con score, with a scaling Fortitude save DC based on how much the damage exceeded the MDT. (There are some exceptions for magic and sneak attack to make it deadly, but not genocidal.) So far, it works pretty well, though players seem a little more reluctant to enter combat without some kind of edge.

I was looking over Unearthed Arcana's rules on MDT and found some interesting things. I think I might use the following:

MDT is equal to CON + level, or CON + 2/level. If the fortitude save fails, the character is at -1. I like this because it still maintains some sense of realism but also gives the character a chance of surviving if he fails the save.