D&D and violence

[Orius]

I read something about this before, and I think the actual problem that the folks (in that instance) had with D&D in prison is that it can allow for imaginary "goods" (Magic Items, gold etc) to be traded for actual items in the prison economy.

It causes an authority chain (responsibility to the DM, for example - I can see this leading to a 'gang mentality'.) If someone threatens my DM, I have to protect him. And my group of gamer buddies take up a large portion of my time, and we probably become a clique. And it's a group that has a leader (a DM).

I'm no expert, but these about the only serious problems I'd foresee. I'm not really sure the Stackpole report really covered these issues. There's also the potential problems with mentally disturbed individuals, but it wouldn't be much different than people with mental porblems who aren't in prison.

But in any case, I'm with the view that says they're in prison and they don't really need luxuries. That would be enough for me to disallow it.

 

[green slime]

Judging by what some people seem to be writing here, it would seem that prisoners should be kept chained to the floor, and force fed intravenously. Bodily waste can just be hosed down a drain: The guards have to earn their keep in some fashion.

I mean, you wouldn't want an inmate getting hold of a spoon, or be able to move an arm, now then would you? Think, he might actually enjoy himself!!

 

[Turanil]

Judging by what some people seem to be writing here, it would seem that prisoners should be kept chained to the floor, and force fed intravenously. Bodily waste can just be hosed down a drain: The guards have to earn their keep in some fashion.

I mean, you wouldn't want an inmate getting hold of a spoon, or be able to move an arm, now then would you? Think, he might actually enjoy himself!!

Think about it : even chained to the floor, he could enjoy sleeping...

 

[WayneLigon]

A large part of this is due to concerns that D&D will lead to violence and gang activity, disconnect with reality, and disrespect for authority. In order to effectively challenge the stance of the prison officials, we may need an expert to testify.

If they are not concerned about the contraband issues but instead about the socialization you mention, you might be out of luck; we are, after all, talking about a game where the number one catchphrase is 'kill them and take their stuff'.

I would be all for prisoners playing D&D but many, many people in prison have 'inability to function in society' as one of their root causes for being in prison in the first place, along with an astoundingly low sense of self-esteem (And I'm not talking about the silly stereotypes of 'Dad never hugged me so I killed all those people'). We're not takling about 'Bob who gets pouty if Mike kills his paladin', we could be talking 'Mike, you're a cheating bastard and you got my Paladin killed, so me and this chair leg here are going to teach you a lesson'.

D&D could help a great deal - it could show them how cooperation with others and compliance with society's laws leads to greater rewards than scoffing those laws. But face it: many, if not most, adventures are constructed around the idea that you're a group of wily people who live outside the main run of society and do as they please because they have the power to do so. For the well-adjusted person, this isn't a problem. For the most part, we're not talking about well-adjusted people here.

Because of this and because each game of D&D is as different as the person GMing it, if I allowed gaming, I'd be damn careful about who got to GM. And I'd be damn careful about who got to play. I think your proposition would go further if you present a plan to that effect.

 

[Nifft]

Some people like to think of prison as rehabilitation, rather than being purely punitive.

For that aspect, I think D&D could be a net positive.

"Shiv'd with a d4", -- N

 

[Kahuna Burger]

One of my neighbors works in a prison where some D&D materials are allowed. IIRC, some of the initial objections were pretty silly, (though in fairness, preventing favoritism is probably a pretty big priority in prison, thus making a certain dogmatism in interpreting rules understandable) but the situation of one prisoner being an authority over others was an issue as well. Which is why he's a popular DM. (having a guard as the DM also could help avoid the potential issues of consequence free violence and increasing power giving you less responsibility to authority, which imo are game/DM specific issues as much as system ones.)

IMO, your best bet would be to look at prisons which do allow D&D*, rather than more general studies. People here love to say things like "Anyone who would be effected by D&D has problems already" which is probably true in most cases, but then when they go on to say "and would have the same problem with anything else" it really isn't. All activities do not have the same potential problems, and prison officials are in a position to be both aware of and very concerned with that fact.

*I'm fairly sure my neighbor works at a Massachusetts prison, but our town is on the border with RI, so that's not out of the question either.

 

[I'm A Banana]

IMO, your best bet would be to look at prisons which do allow D&D*, rather than more general studies.

I'll say this is a very good point. Other prisons are likely going to be the most 'similar' examples, and, as a few posters have pointed out, some prisons allow RPG's.

And I know it's hard, but all the political discourse going around is kind of obscuring the central point of the thread. If you wanna talk about what prisons should be or whether the game should be allowed at all, take it over to CM, yo.

 

[jdrakeh]

That sounds more like a county jail environment...

Or a SuperMax environment

 

[akbearfoot]

I can see banning dice because of gambling concerns....but then again, I was pretty sure most long-term inmates have access to sports on Television, and to decks of playing cards. So there are already plenty of ways to gamble in prisons. I would also bet money that(tee-hee) the habitual gamblers have already smuggled dice in, just like the drug addicts get booze and drugs snuck in. There are other ways to handle dice rolling without actually rolling dice.
Various studies have proven (or at least strongly suggested)that RPGs aid in the development of numerous positive mental skills. And to date, not a single crime has ever been attributed to being caused by a RPG. Plenty of people have 'suspected' as such or even tried to use an RPG as a scapegoat, but RPGs have never been sited as being a primary factor in any crime. I just spent a little while trying to find something to prove that claim incorrect, but was unable to. If anyone knows of an example to disprove my statement, I very much would like to read about it. A couple years ago I remember watching one of those D&D videos and they actually sited a specific # of crimes where D&D specifically was listed in association with crimes and suicides, but in every case those suspicions were dropped.

It seems like most of the people posting on this board are of the opinion that prisoners don't deserve to have any fun in prison....kinda makes any sort of rehabilitation an impossibility. If I knew there was a way to help a group of people decrease racial tensions, improve reading skills, basic math skills, problem solving skills, and vocabulary, and that they would have fun while they were doing it I would jump all over that.

Asside from possibly desensitizing an extremely sheltered person to the IDEA of violence, I question any claim that D&D or role-playing games in general has ever or will ever harm me physically or mentally. Nobody with access to basic cable and any PG rated station can say that they were never exposed to violence until they played an RPG. I actually see a lot board games as roleplaying games, only with less complexity. Monopoly puts you in the role of a business tycoon whos ONLY goal is to bankrupt your friends and drive them to the streets penniless...Chess teaches you to sacrifice your pawns in order to achieve victory over your opponents. Clue, Axis and Allies, battleship, Life, Operation, and plenty others are limited versions of role-playing games.

The idea that letting inmates play D&D will change the group mentality of the prison seems rediculous to me. Obviously not every inmate would want to play a RPG, but then again most criminals aren't serving hard time for very violent crimes. What about all the average guys in average prisons. I don't know how prisons actually work, but I don't imagine that you'd have a lot of guys who are serving life terms mixed in with the guy that got caught stealing a rack of soda at the local 7-11. I don't picture actual prisons working like the show OZ....Paris Hilton didn't go to San Quentin, for example. If Joe bob has violent tendencies, then his fellow inmates are probably already avoiding him...and as normal, if you act up in prison, you're going to be punished with solitary confinement or whatever. If I were in prison, and I was allowed to play RPGs, I would consider that MASSIVE motivation for me to be well-behaved. In real life I used to have to finish my homework before my friends could come over and game with me. Guess who did his homework early on game nights

FWIW I've never been in prison, and I am fairly confident that I wouldn't survive an extended stay in once. But for some reason, this thread really caught my attention.

 

[JDJblatherings]

Not everyone in prison is a monster (or even guilty). I myself would rather they read and went to shool in prison so there is an outside chance they'd catch on that crime doesn't pay all that well after all. Dice and pencils in a violent population = bad idea. But not every prison popualtion is violent, rpgs should really folow any other game rules in a prison.

One friend was a prison guard recently and some of the population played Magic the Gathering at his fascility and surprisngly enough there was limited card theft (it did happen but not vey often). Magic the Gathering was involved in far less disputes and disciplinary actions then video games were.