We know Dwarves in various settings like Greyhawk, Dragonlance, FR, ect... are discussed thank to the article in Dragon+, it'd be shocking if this is not also true in FR. The Crown wars are an event that is too important not to mention in the FR section.
D&D 5E D&D Beyond: Raven Queen
We know Dwarves in various settings like Greyhawk, Dragonlance, FR, ect... are discussed thank to the article in Dragon+, it'd be shocking if this is not also true in FR. The Crown wars are an event that is too important not to mention in the FR section.
S
Sunseeker
Guest
Have you read the lore about them in the older Ravenlofts? It's literally stupid. A sentient race of semi-diety ravens that people worship in the Ravenloft setting for *reasons*. Half of the "big reveals" in the old story were also supposed to be given out by these ravens. They're not ravens who look at you funny and caw out a few words, they're ravens of great exposition. And frankly, it's REALLY lame.
Azzy
ᚳᚣᚾᛖᚹᚢᛚᚠ
There is no single "crow" species, there are American crows, hooded crows, carrion crows, etc. However, the word crow is generally used for all corvids (especially of the genus Corvus). Ravens, jackdaws, rooks, etc. are all of the genus corvus (and are thus crows).
MonsterEnvy
Legend
We have Kelemvor and Wee Jas that did the same thing as the Raven Queen. Raven Queen is very similar in fact to Wee Jas.
Also which stupid talking Ravens. The only ones I can think of that do that are the Wereravens.
I have sometimes a feeling that when they were making deities for 4e they pretty much picked Wee Jas, focused her portfolio more around death and painted her hair black. Because a lot of it fits. Mostly LN (well 4e didnt have LN, but her description makes think of that) the few backstory elements hinting her having been a powerful spellcaster in mortal life as a nod to the mess of Wee Jas' portfolio.
S
Sunseeker
Guest
In at least the 2E Ravenloft material I've got here, all of the "Raven-whatever" like the Symbol of Ravenkind, were all tied to the remnants of a Raven-based religion that Strahd supposedly scoured from Barovia. They apparently worship sentient ravens or something.
This wiki is slow to load, but here's the cliffnotes: http://www.fraternityofshadows.com/wiki/Category:Ravenkin
I find this absolutely ridiculous and highly out of character for the rest of the theme of Ravenloft. I get that some people think Ravenloft should be treated as more camp and I understand that comes in part from the age of the material (and general viewer cynicism) and its fine in that context, but I don't feel its fitting if you intend to take the setting and the game seriously. To be fair, I'm essentially replacing Andral, a god of which there is very little writing, with The Raven Queen. I doubt anyone will take much notice except me, but since the change is for my sanity that's fine.
Yes, sometimes I like to have serious fun. Seriously.
Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
Sure, but within the context of the conversation at hand, it is not accurate to say "ravens are crows." The complaint was made that sentient talking ravens in Curse of Strahd were dumb. The rebuttal was made that crows are highly intelligent and capable of mimicking human speech, and in fantasy fiction, ravens tend to share this attribute. From context, it is clear that the rebuttal is using the words "crow" and "raven" to refer to distinct groups of Corvidae, much as the terms "jackdaw," "rook," "magpie," etc. refer to several different species within the genus.
It would be accurate to counter this argument by pointing out that most species of raven are just as capable of mimickry as most species of crow. Or that there is very little actual distinction between species with "crow" and "raven" in their common names, apart from ravens generally being slightly bigger. But to try to rebut it by going after the usage of the words crow and raven is just pedantic. Furthermore, claiming that "ravens are crows" despite the fact that there is a convention in the common names of corvid species of referring to the larger species as ravens and the smaller as crows, while not technically inaccurate, is certainly dubious, given that it is contrary to the way the words are actually used in common parlance.
Last edited:
Charlaquin
Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
Wow, ok, I liked the last video because it acknowledged the 4e version of the Raven Queen and pointed out why she might be viewed differently in different settings. This one, though? Ugh, I really don't care for the new backstory they've made for her. Which wouldn't be a problem, except that in this video it's stated so matter-of-factly, with absolutely no acknowledgement of the fact that this is a departure from her original backstory. They almost got there with the discussion of the Shadar-Kai (and in general I liked that half of the video better), but instead of actually talking about how and why they changed between editions, he just kind of talked vaguely about "emphasis" and brushed it aside. Which is exactly what I was hoping they wouldn't do. Make up a new backstory for the character for 5e's setting, fine, but don't snub the original backstory while you're at it.
doctorbadwolf
Heretic of The Seventh Circle
Ravens ARE crows.
This anti-corvidist rhetoric will not fly!
Also am I the only one that got that you were making a joke?
edit: ah man, you were just being pedantic about cladistic classifications?
lame.
Last edited:
Similar Threads
