D20 Marvel

[victordoom]

Hero progression

I used to think it really never made since to have a level based supes game. To me it always seemed the heros were all set to go when their comic got started. But back in the late 80's I think comic book writers started showing interest in telling the stories of a the heros learning the ropes, thus titles like Batman : Year one and such. It does really make since if you think about it . I think Thor wood not find much challenge from the Saturn men now, but back then they were percieved a threat. Spidey would hand the enforcers over to the cops and not break a sweat now but back in the day they gave him all he could handle.
So heros do grow and gain experience and levels do as good a job as anything to reflect this growth. This doesn't mean one night you and yor buddies can't get together and use the Avengers (most of those guys are at leaste 8th level) and kick some but. Or for that matter create a character at whatever level you want and play with him. Who knows maybe one night you and your GM can decide to run a year one campaign with you using an early incarnation of your high level character.

 

[trancejeremy]

How well would a class/level based superhero game work? I've never seen much advancement among superheroes, they kind of just "are". I'm not saying it wouldn't work, and I'm interested in seeing how the systems look.

One of the first Superhero RPGs, Villains & Vigilantes, had levels. Had a very big following at one time.

 

[quindia]

I disagree that super heroes in the comics do not typically increase in power or gain new abilities. First of all, a first level hero is the equivilant of his or her counterpart in D&D... a neophyte adventurer. Just looking at one Marvel series, all of the original X-Men were clumsy with their powers in the beginning. That's what the danger room sessions were for. Their powers grew and they added more "stunts" as they gained experience. Magneto has all kind of abilities that he never displayed in those early books. Beast and Jean Grey changed completely. Later characters like Aerial went from a teenage girl who could walk through walls to Shadowcat, an intangible ninja who could apply her single power to a much broader range of situations (air walk, etc.). Rogue went through a transformation as well when she permanently gained Ms Marvels powers. All of the New Mutants changed and grew more powerful as their book progressed.

In any case, the Paragon rules tie beginning powers to race or origin. Only one class allows a character to increase his powers. These increases may be in the form of greater strength of an existing power or more control of that power(gaining "stunts" or eliminating limitations) or, yes, that class may add a new power. However, when allowing a new power, the GM should have a reason. A telepath might add psychic attack as a development of her mental powers, but should be discouraged from suddenly growing wings. A new power may also only be added at the least powerful rank and will not be on par with established powers, so I have found it is usually better to develop abilities the character already possesses.

It is also not required that you begin play as a neophyte hero. If you want to represent established crime fighters, simply make 12th level characters. The Meta-human class (the only one to gain powers as I mentioned above) only allows power enhancements at 2nd, 5th, 11th, 14th, and 20th, so it's not like a character would change radically every time he gained a level. In any case, character improvement when gaining levels is part of the d20 system. It's what players expect.

 

[Horacio]

They only thing I dislike from Paragon is Energy. I hate having an Energy pool, and zhen exhausting it beign without powers for an hour. It is too D&D Magic System for me.

X-Men don't have Energy

 

[victordoom]

I disagree, the x-men(along with most modern age heros) do have limits to how long they can sustain a power. I can't tell you how many time I heard Psylock or havok cry " I can't keep this up much longer"(clearly this could mean something else entirely for Havok)Many heros however can push themselves beyond their power limit for short periods of time and there are feats that allow you to accomplish this.
In the playtest we tried the 2 characters were power heavy so we could see how the energy thing went. Niether of us depleted our energy pool by time the fight ended. Super strength and the like hardly dent your power (only when you push them)usaully its energy blast and stuff like that. It worked well in the playtest so give it a shot!

 

[Horacio]

I tried it in playtest, that's why I don't like it. It's a lot more restrictive than, let's say, Hero System's Endurance. IMHO, of course...

 

[Steve Conan Trustrum]

How well would a class/level based superhero game work? I've never seen much advancement among superheroes, they kind of just "are". I'm not saying it wouldn't work, and I'm interested in seeing how the systems look.

Look at Heroes Unlimited by Palladium Games if you want to see a level system for comic book rpg'ing. I've never really liked superpowers being tied to levels, however (even though I've got tons of HU info up on my site and even freelanced for the product line a bit), as there are too many inherent problems such as it being impossible to have a character that is really strong with one power but remarkably weak with another.

 

[Steve Conan Trustrum]

I tried it in playtest, that's why I don't like it. It's a lot more restrictive than, let's say, Hero System's Endurance. IMHO, of course...

This, among other things, is why I'll stick with Heroes for my comic book rpg'ing - I've yet to come across a system that handles the genre as well and has, as promised, allowed me to make absolutely every superhero or villain that I've thus far conceived (and I've had some odd ones), and all without a need to tweak or customize.

I think just about every system handles certain genres well - I wouldn't want to even attempt playing fantasy under the Hero System, for instance, because there are products like 3e that handle it so much better.

 

[Horacio]

I would advise you to wait for d20 Supers from Morrus and Natural 20 Press. After seeing the preview in Asgard, I think it can be what you're searching for.

 

[victordoom]

Horacio, thanks for giving it a shot and wished it would have worked for you. I would appreciate it if you got the time to send a more detailed example of what frustrated you . We learn more from negative comments than any other. Was it just not having enough power for low level or was it with every level? Any information you could provide would be appreciated and respected. Just send it to me so I can pass it on to Paragon or Quindia or you can go directly to the paragon site to leave comments.
To me its still the best d20 supes game yet and next week we start playtesting with a group and I'll provide updates and let people know how it goes. Thanks again to Horacio for speaking up.