Death Saving Throw: Roll 20 or higher, spend surge then?

[mudlock]

Next time that I DM I think that I'll have it where once you make a death save, your still unconcious until your turn comes around again. Or unless someone else gives you an action.

But that could be because I'm too used to DM's dogpiling every creature possible on the weakest link. I've seen where you wake up with a death save/heal and get gang banged before your turn rolls around happen way too often for my tastes.

If you're playing with a DM like that, don't heal someone who's just going to get dog-piled. Tactically, it's better to let them roll a few death saves (hey, they can fail two and be no worse for wear in 5 minutes!) and use the heal once the rest of the party is in a position to protect them.

 

[Prestidigitalis]

The feat Timely Revival lets you make death saves at start of turn instead of -- not in addition to -- end of turn, but it's epic tier and humans only.

 

[renau1g]

Next time that I DM I think that I'll have it where once you make a death save, your still unconcious until your turn comes around again. Or unless someone else gives you an action.

But that could be because I'm too used to DM's dogpiling every creature possible on the weakest link. I've seen where you wake up with a death save/heal and get gang banged before your turn rolls around happen way too often for my tastes.

The other side of the coin if you're helpless and dying, the DM may have them start Coup de Grace actions instead. That's far worse...

 

[the Jester]

Don't forget Die Hard, either- +5 on that third death save is awesome. It saved the barbarian's life IMC 2 games ago.

 

[Insight]

How do you roll above a 20 on a d20? Just curious, since in my 20+ years of playing RPGs, I have never seen it happen.

I got a 21 once, but I think that was at the blackjack table.

 

[sigfile]

How do you roll above a 20 on a d20? Just curious, since in my 20+ years of playing RPGs, I have never seen it happen.

Just in case the question is serious... It's the result of the death saving throw that needs to be a 20+. So if the roll of a d20 plus any applicable bonuses to saving throws comes out to 20 or better, the character may spend a healing surge.

I keep running in to Encounters and LFR tables that believe rolling a natural 20 on a death save is the only way to spend that healing surge. For anyone that tends to draw a lot of fire, "Disciple of Death" is a great feat.

If the question wasn't serious... moo. Move along.

 

[the Jester]

How do you roll above a 20 on a d20? Just curious, since in my 20+ years of playing RPGs, I have never seen it happen.

I got a 21 once, but I think that was at the blackjack table.

For instance if you roll a 16 on your third death save and you have Die Hard, which gives you +5.

 

[bryanlo]

How do you roll above a 20 on a d20? Just curious, since in my 20+ years of playing RPGs, I have never seen it happen.

I got a 21 once, but I think that was at the blackjack table.

Well at my table the warpriest has a feat called Harbinger of Rebirth. Anyone within 5 squares that makes a death saving throw gets +5 to it. So if he rolls over 15, voila you get over 20.

 

[renau1g]

The Raven Cloak neck item grants a +10 save bonus to death save 1/day as well. Combine with Warden + human's various saving throw feat bonuses you can easily get it on a 7-8.

Heck if you combined that with the Harbinger of Rebirth you'd be up and going on a 2 or so.

 

[Dausuul]

I keep running in to Encounters and LFR tables that believe rolling a natural 20 on a death save is the only way to spend that healing surge.

IMO, this is a side effect of the critical hit rules. You have to roll a natural 20 to score a crit. Getting a "spend a healing surge!" result on a death save is a very similar mechanic that triggers when you get a 20. Therefore, players draw the logical inference that a natural 20 is required even though the rules do not actually say so. If you'd asked me, I could not have stated with confidence that you didn't need a natural 20.

I think the game designers would have been best served to write it as requiring a natural 20 and then build in specific exceptions for feats that grant death save bonuses: "You get a +5 on death saves, and can spend a healing surge if this results in a total of 20 or higher."

As things stand, they're screwed no matter what they do. If they fix the death save system to match the critical hit system, or remove the "healing surge on 20" rule altogether, they'll confuse players who've gotten used to the current system.