Deck of Many Things Replacement

[Baileyborough]

Hi there,

I'm running a 4e campaign for some friends on a semi-regular basis. Now that the Madness at Gardmore Abbey is on the way out, I'm thinking it's a great fit for one of my Paladin characters - Gardmore could have been his place of training etc.

But.

I am not a fan of the Deck of Many Things. The general concensus I've heard is that it's a bit of a campaign killer, and I'm not keen on using it. So I'm asking you guys if you have any suggestions for a powerful but dangerous magical item (possibly even cursed). Something that lends sufficient weight to the place falling apart.

Cheers in advance,

C.

 

[fba827]

I don't know artifacts off the top of my head, so i can't suggest an existing thing. But you could build your own and leave it vague... something like:
The Sword of X - once a holy avenger sword (or other type of weapon that your paladin likes) that was used to seal a magical rift. but the magic of the rift was absorbed into the sword and now it is slowly leaking out energies over the decades of being kept at Gradmore, causing the place to fall apart with the chaos.
And after the party retrieves it and stops the problem, the clergy wants to take the blade and purify it (thus removing it from the party with the possibility of the paladin getting it again in the future as a reward after it's been purified which would take several months/years)

As an aside, the lore, setup, and even sidequests of "Madness of Gradmore Abbey" -- as presented -- are very deeply rooted in the effects from the Deck, so if you aren't going to use the Deck, you won't get -as much- out of it without being ready to do a lot of tweaking.

Not that it would be impossible so it could be done since the adventure is presented very open ended to use what you want. but to make the amount of changes you might consider not getting the published adventure and instead just using the concept "the abbey has gone to ruin/chaos because of an artifact" and the making up your own layout/encounters to fit the thematics of the lore behind the artifact that you do use.

 

[aco175]

You must be speaking of the old 3e Deck, because the 4e version is something I find rather lame and cannot fear its awesomeness.

 

[fba827]

You must be speaking of the old 3e Deck, because the 4e version is something I find rather lame and cannot fear its awesomeness.

yeah, i do have to agree that the 4e version is quite neutered compared to prior editions.

Plus, the adventure is about gathering the cards (so you can't even use the "Deck" properties/powers/card for the majority of the adventure as presented, though you can use minor properties from individual cards as you collect them.

But in any case, if the OP doesn't like the Deck then i don't think i'll convince him otherwise..

 

[OnlineDM]

I'm planning on running Madness at Gardmore Abbey for one of my groups in the near future, and I've read through the first of the four books so far (including the description of the Deck of Many Things). Could you talk more about the "campaign killer" nature of the Deck? I didn't see anything in it that worried me when I gave it a read-through, which makes me worry that I'm missing something problematic.

 

[S'mon]

Not that it would be impossible so it could be done since the adventure is presented very open ended to use what you want. but to make the amount of changes you might consider not getting the published adventure and instead just using the concept "the abbey has gone to ruin/chaos because of an artifact" and the making up your own layout/encounters to fit the thematics of the lore behind the artifact that you do use.

Maybe play Diablo again for some more inspiration.

 

[SoulsFury]

You must be speaking of the old 3e Deck, because the 4e version is something I find rather lame and cannot fear its awesomeness.

The deck is definitely weak compared to older editions. My players are starting the adventure now. I homebrew and change any published adventured, but the basis will be to complete the deck.

Currently, my group entered a portal to the Shadowfell, which is where I am placing the abbey. In my campaign, the abbey is the home of a wanna be God-King that hid his keep. The characters will have to rescue a group of githerazai and the entire town of the abbey by reconstructing the deck. Once the deck is reconstructed, they can enter a tower I have added to the map, and confront part of the main villain of the campaign. I will also be using the descriptions of cards in dungeon mag, as opposed to what is available in the adventure.

The deck has always held a special place for me in my D&D experience and I can't wait for the awesomeness it will bring to the group going through this adventure. To me, its not a campaign killer, but a campaign maker.

 

[DNH]

I would reinforce what has been said above; namely, that while you certainly *can* replace the Deck of Many Things with something else, the deck really does play a central role in the adventure.
* POSSIBLE SPOILERS BELOW *
Much of the deck is scattered about randomly among the encounters and which ones are where can have a greater or lesser impact on how those encounters play out. For example, cards in the possession of a villain NPC will be used by that villain during an encounter. Also, there are rival adventurers who will be encountered at various points during the adventure; those points are determined by the random draw of cards (as well as those cards being in possession of the rival adventurers and available to use by them. Finally, the whole denouement of the adventure is determined by a random draw of a card from the deck (although you can safely do as I did and select an appropriate one). So it's all pretty much intertwined.

I am the last person to say that you can't take the adventure and alter it to suit your game (I play a campaign in Mystara, so I kinda have to do that every time) but you would be creating a LOT of work for yourself if you choose to remove the Deck of Many Things in favour of something else. Or rather, you would be losing a LOT of what makes this adventure interesting.

For the record, I have played every edition of D&D except for "Chainmail" and I can remember the old 1e deck which truly WAS an artifact to be feared. This 4e version is a lot more tame as it has to provide concrete rules for its effects that work within the 4e mechanics (I am sidestepping here the issue that new gamers prefer formulaic rules for their games, as opposed to more nebulous guidelines). So it is not the "campaign-killer" you fear. And apart from anything else, the whole deck is not assembled (and therefore available as the artifact) until that denouement at the end of the adventure.

 

[Nullzone]

I'm planning on running Madness at Gardmore Abbey for one of my groups in the near future, and I've read through the first of the four books so far (including the description of the Deck of Many Things). Could you talk more about the "campaign killer" nature of the Deck? I didn't see anything in it that worried me when I gave it a read-through, which makes me worry that I'm missing something problematic.

(This is the oldschool deck reference, but figured it appropriate)

 

[Zaran]

Hi there,

I'm running a 4e campaign for some friends on a semi-regular basis. Now that the Madness at Gardmore Abbey is on the way out, I'm thinking it's a great fit for one of my Paladin characters - Gardmore could have been his place of training etc.

But.

I am not a fan of the Deck of Many Things. The general concensus I've heard is that it's a bit of a campaign killer, and I'm not keen on using it. So I'm asking you guys if you have any suggestions for a powerful but dangerous magical item (possibly even cursed). Something that lends sufficient weight to the place falling apart.

Cheers in advance,

C.

The Deck is what caused the Abbey's destruction. It can easily be that the paladin's quest would be to destroy the deck. It doesn't have be quested for to actually use.