Do you feel threatened by sign language?

[Kramodlog]

Sounds silly, but it a deaf guy is suing cops for tasing him cause they didn't know or didn't recognize he was using sound language.

Granted I wasn't there and maybe he was threatening, but I'd figure that before going for the taser someone might notice that the guy is usig sign language.

 

[Altamont Ravenard]

Or then again, when you notice that a couple of cops are red in the face from yelling at you, you should just lie on the ground to reduce the risks of injury. I am in no way implying that what transpired was the deaf man's fault and I hope everything gets resolved in a satisfactory matter for all involved.

AR

 

[Homicidal_Squirrel]

Over the years there have been several news stories of people using sign language and gang members thinking that the person was flashing gang signs. Those stories usually end up far worse than what happened to this guy. In any case, yes, cops need far more training. Unfortunately they don't have the funds to get that training. Add in the fact that they need to be taken off the streets in order to get the training, and you run into the problem that there are not enough cops out there to do this.

This incident is just an example of the things that can happen when you don't properly fund and train a police force.

 

[tomBitonti]

The unfortunate man never had a chance to sign: One of the first things the police did was to grab his hands.

The article doesn't mention anything that the man was doing that was threatening, nor anything that was suspicious. They seem to have operated wholly on the word of neighbors.

Anyone know what are the rules for escalating force? Certainly, there must be guidelines for encounters with deaf (or blind, or mute) people. And certainly, the deaf are not so rare as there would not be such guidelines. (I have a nephew-in-law who is deaf, for example. Hearing problems are common amount the aged, and are probably not too uncommon among wounded veterans as a consequence of IED's and other explosives.)

Those whose livelihood involves the use of deadly force, must use that force responsibly. I don't see a difference between police who lack training and a person operating a vehicle for which they lack training. Harm is the clear and predictable consequence.

Thx!

TomB

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Training could help, but in fairness, its not a panacea.

In fairness, the deaf guy was in no different a situation than anyone else who does not speak any language in common with the police. Makes it hard to comply.

Example: A buddy of mine was a lawyer in Los Angeles. He told me that many documents are printed in over 2 dozen languages- including Braille- there because there are that many languages commonly spoken in the area. While the justice system has personnel trained in all of those languages on the payroll or speed dial.

Which is awesome.

But is it realistic to expect patrol officers to be fluent or even conversant in that many languages? I'm pretty sure that even in countries like Switzerland- with 3 official languages and a fourth widely spoken- not every patrolman is fluent in all of them.

So how many languages do we expect patrol officers to learn?

And if language training isn't the answer, what other training could be effective in reducing the liklihood of a repeat of this incident?

 

[Hand of Evil]

There is only a couple of hand signs that I feel threatened from, they use a finger or two.


First thing, by grabbing his hands, the guy was denied right of free speech.
Two, because of being deaf, he never was presented his rights.

 

[Zombie_Babies]

There is only a couple of hand signs that I feel threatened from, they use a finger or two.


First thing, by grabbing his hands, the guy was denied right of free speech.
Two, because of being deaf, he never was presented his rights.

Only if the cops knew he was deaf. Aside from that, you can't possibly expect every police officer everywhere to know ASL at least well enough to read someone their rights. It's also incredibly possible that once he was booked someone at the station signed him the pertinent info. Plus it's not like the cops could use anything he said against him so the whole thing with having a lawyer present is a little less immediately important.

Anyhoo, it sounds to me like they were out of line and escalated things for no reason. Without having been there I can't say for sure. The point above, though, is that it's really easy to see something like this and then come up with some very unreasonable expectations.

 

[Umbran]

Or then again, when you notice that a couple of cops are red in the face from yelling at you, you should just lie on the ground to reduce the risks of injury.

If you are deaf, and lie face down on the ground, you have now pretty much lost all chance of communication. You can't sign, and you can't even tell the police are talking, because you can't see them The cops are already red in the face from yelling at you? If you then lie on the ground and (from their perspective) ignore them, you may not be in for better times.

I don't require that police learn sign language, but there is, in my mind, exactly zero excuse for them to not recognize it on sight. Any officer of the law may be required to deal with the deaf or blind at any time, and should have at least basic preparedness.

 

[Hand of Evil]

I am trying to remember the name of a movie from the 30's - 40's dealing with tetanus, where the guy could not talk nor raise his hands and got shot by the police in the story, he was being framed and cut himself in the beginning. They ending up taking him in and he gets the vaccination and is able to provide the clues for the police to catch the villain. Story wise it was a good plot twist.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I don't require that police learn sign language, but there is, in my mind, exactly zero excuse for them to not recognize it on sight. Any officer of the law may be required to deal with the deaf or blind at any time, and should have at least basic preparedness.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StEFnh18zRk

I jest, but actually, that is an excellent point.