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Dragonne full attack, all at +12?

Blustar

First Post
I was looking through the Bonus Bestiary ( free RPG day) and noticed that the Dragonne (on page 10) has under melee:bite +12, 2 claws +12. The 3.5 Monster Manual the bite at 12 and the 2 claws attack at +7. Is this change intentional or an oversight?

Or am I allowed now to pick either attack as the main attack and the reduce one by five if I do a full attack?


thanks
 

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frankthedm

First Post
it looks like monsters get their attacks non staggered. No more -5 for non primary, no more 1/2 str bonus for non primary.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com said:
Tiger, Dire CR8

Melee 2 claws +18 (2d4+8 plus grab), bite +18 (2d6+8/19–20 plus grab)
 
Last edited:

Jadeite

Hero
But strangely, the multiattack feat seems to be still in the game:
Animal Companions said:
Multiattack: An animal companion gains Multiattack as a bonus feat if it has three or more natural attacks and does not already have that feat. If it does not have the requisite three or more natural attacks, the animal companion instead gains a second attack with one of its natural weapons, albeit at a –5 penalty.
 

elnopintan

First Post
But this multiattack is different. It says three or more attacks, so it seems that the penalty only applies to the third natural attack.
 

Jadeite

Hero
But this multiattack is different. It says three or more attacks, so it seems that the penalty only applies to the third natural attack.

Multiattack always said 'Three or more attacks'. Here is the version of the 3.5 SRD.

3.5 SRD said:
Multiattack [General]
Prerequisite Three or more natural attacks.
Benefit The creature’s secondary attacks with natural weapons take only a -2 penalty.
Normal Without this feat, the creature’s secondary attacks with natural weapons take a -5 penalty.
 

Zaister

Explorer
Primary and secondary attacks work differently in the Pathfinder RPG. Check out the rules for natural attacks:

Pathfinder Reference Document said:
Natural Attacks: Attacks made with natural weapons, such as claws and bites, are melee attacks that can be made against any creature within your reach (usually 5 feet). These attacks are made using your full attack bonus and deal an amount of damage that depends on their type (plus your Strength modifier, as normal). You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus. Instead, you receive additional attack rolls for multiple limb and body parts capable of making the attack (as noted by the race or ability that grants the attacks). If you possess only one natural attack (such as a bite—two claw attacks do not qualify), you add 1–1/2 times your Strength bonus on damage rolls made with that attack.

Some natural attacks are denoted as secondary natural attacks, such as tails and wings. Attacks with secondary natural attacks are made using your base attack bonus minus 5. These attacks deal an amount of damage depending on their type, but you only add half your Strength modifier on damage rolls.

You can make attacks with natural weapons in combination with attacks made with a melee weapon and unarmed strikes, so long as a different limb is used for each attack. For example, you cannot make a claw attack and also use that hand to make attacks with a longsword. When you make additional attacks in this way, all of your natural attacks are treated as secondary natural attacks, using your base attack bonus minus 5 and adding only 1/2 of your Strength modifier on damage rolls. In addition, all of your attacks made with melee weapons and unarmed strikes are made as if you were two-weapon fighting. Your natural attacks are treated as light, off-hand weapons for determining the penalty to your other attacks. Feats such as Two-Weapon Fighting and Multiattack can reduce these penalties.

Claw and bite now are always primary attacks. Something like a wing buffet or tail slap would be a secondary attack and get the -5 and half Strength bonus treatment. Claw and bite, however, are always at full attack and Strength bonuses.
 

Jadeite

Hero
This is quite powerful. Druids will love it. And it makes sense, that all the creatures with multiple natural attacks like hippogriffs and black bears have been removed from the low levels of summon nature's ally.
Although wolfs being on level 2 while riding dogs are level 1 still doesn't make any sense.
 

Minicol

Adventurer
Supporter
This is quite powerful. Druids will love it. And it makes sense, that all the creatures with multiple natural attacks like hippogriffs and black bears have been removed from the low levels of summon nature's ally.
Although wolfs being on level 2 while riding dogs are level 1 still doesn't make any sense.

That's GREAT !!!!!

Now my monsters will be a lot more scary, and I will not have my resident rules lawyer saying things like don't worry, it can only it you with it's primary ...

Aside from that, this is how it worked in 1e, so .... that's good.
 


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