D&D General E. Gary Gygax auction Nov 2023

[Parmandur]

yeah, but even at the time Gary must have known that it grossed 4x it's budget, and made more at the box office than Tootsie, Tron, Fast Times at Ridgemont High, and Blade Runner.

He said he wanted a successful movie while lambasting what a successful fantasy movie actually was by letting his bias completely cause him to ignore the facts.

It is good to re recall that this was not a period when Gygax was at...ummm...his clearest thinking.

 

[LordEntrails]

This didn't age well

"Gygax stresses that “we didn’t want to end up with the rather disastrous type of movie that Tolkien’s ring trilogy ended up with,” referring to the early animated features."

...

"The recent release of the first Arnold Schwarzenegger film Conan the Barbarian gave Gygax an example of how not to make a fantasy film: he panned it in the pages of the Dragon magazine, adding “badly done films seem more likely to destroy interest in fantasy rather than build it.”

And their is a picture of CB2 with Conan/Schwarzenegger on the cover...

 

[DarkCrisis]

This didn't age well

"Gygax stresses that “we didn’t want to end up with the rather disastrous type of movie that Tolkien’s ring trilogy ended up with,” referring to the early animated features."

...

"The recent release of the first Arnold Schwarzenegger film Conan the Barbarian gave Gygax an example of how not to make a fantasy film: he panned it in the pages of the Dragon magazine, adding “badly done films seem more likely to destroy interest in fantasy rather than build it.”

There a review by one of the TSR guys in Dragon for the The Hobbit animated film and he roasts it. I was kind of surprised because I've always loved it, but I can see how a purist might offense. Same with Gygax and Conan.

Heck same with any fan of a book turned into a film or TV show. Still happens to this day.

 

[Sacrosanct]

There a review by one of the TSR guys in Dragon for the The Hobbit animated film and he roasts it. I was kind of surprised because I've always loved it, but I can see how a purist might offense. Same with Gygax and Conan.

Heck same with any fan of a book turned into a film or TV show. Still happens to this day.

That was by Tim Kask.

 

[Mannahnin]

There a review by one of the TSR guys in Dragon for the The Hobbit animated film and he roasts it. I was kind of surprised because I've always loved it, but I can see how a purist might offense. Same with Gygax and Conan.

Heck same with any fan of a book turned into a film or TV show. Still happens to this day.

Yup. The 1977 animated Hobbit and Conan the Barbarian are definite poster children for movies which diverge from the source material in ways which were kind of infuriating for purist fans lacking perspective (as I have been, at times) but are surprisingly good in their own right.

Today I can be disappointed by the abridgements in the 1977 Hobbit and still scratch my head at its weird portrayal of elves, while recognizing that it is generally quite faithful and uses some of the best dialogue, that the animation is generally excellent, and that the casting and voice acting is absolutely stellar (Orson Bean, John Huston, Richard Boone(!), John Stephenson...).

 

[LordEntrails]

Convention badges? I can see those as display filler in a museum, but other than that?

 

[billd91]

Yup. The 1977 animated Hobbit and Conan the Barbarian are definite poster children for movies which diverge from the source material in ways which were kind of infuriating for purist fans lacking perspective (as I have been, at times) but are surprisingly good in their own right.

Today I can be disappointed by the abridgements in the 1977 Hobbit and still scratch my head at its weird portrayal of elves, while recognizing that it is generally quite faithful and uses some of the best dialogue, that the animation is generally excellent, and that the casting and voice acting is absolutely stellar (Orson Bean, John Huston, Richard Boone(!), John Stephenson...).

And it sure captures the spirit of the original so much better than the overblown, overlong, big budget Hobbit trilogy we got.

 

[Mannahnin]

And it sure captures the spirit of the original so much better than the overblown, overlong, big budget Hobbit trilogy we got.

Yeah, while there are good spots in the live action trilogy, it certainly did a lot to make the 1977 TV movie look wonderful by comparison.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Yup. The 1977 animated Hobbit and Conan the Barbarian are definite poster children for movies which diverge from the source material in ways which were kind of infuriating for purist fans lacking perspective (as I have been, at times) but are surprisingly good in their own right.

Today I can be disappointed by the abridgements in the 1977 Hobbit and still scratch my head at its weird portrayal of elves, while recognizing that it is generally quite faithful and uses some of the best dialogue, that the animation is generally excellent, and that the casting and voice acting is absolutely stellar (Orson Bean, John Huston, Richard Boone(!), John Stephenson...).

I think Gary's biggest problem was he viewed D&D as "S3R1US B1ZN3SS". The game grew because of kids. It's like he forgot it's a game. It wouldn't have grown much if you focused on increasing gamers in the middle aged demographic. It's true even today. Being campy, a bit silly, and full of fantasy is what is increasing the gamers in the hobby. It's always been that way. I don't blame him for thinking that way considering his background, but it's a pretty good example of bad management by letting biases overrule the data.

 

[Parmandur]

I think Gary's biggest problem was he viewed D&D as "S3R1US B1ZN3SS". The game grew because of kids. It's like he forgot it's a game. It wouldn't have grown much if you focused on increasing gamers in the middle aged demographic. It's true even today. Being campy, a bit silly, and full of fantasy is what is increasing the gamers in the hobby. It's always been that way. I don't blame him for thinking that way considering his background, but it's a pretty good example of bad management by letting biases overrule the data.

I mean, I was reading B2 Keep on the Vorderlands last night, and I don't think that is it: Gygax had a perhaps overly developed sense of humor and whimsy.

And the DeLaurentis Conan productions are not what I would call lighthearted and whimsical. Indeed, maybe he felt they were a bit too Po-faced: at the time he wrote that critique, he was knee-deep in production of the D&D cartoon: a not-so-swrious whimsical production aimed at children and families.