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Effect of 4th Edition on DDO
- Thread starter LostInTheMists
- Start date
GlassJaw
Hero
Turbine keeps adding content to DDO, has maintained a very loyal player base, and isn't really showing any signs of falling apart anytime soon. Quite the opposite really. So yeah, I'm sure their subscriber numbers are low in the grand scheme of things but I'm sure it continues to be profitable for them to maintain it.
That aside, DDO is a GREAT game right now, especially compared to where it was when it was released. That's part of the problem though, and they did it to themselves - they released a game that wasn't ready and established a fairly negative reputation.
That aside, DDO is a GREAT game right now, especially compared to where it was when it was released. That's part of the problem though, and they did it to themselves - they released a game that wasn't ready and established a fairly negative reputation.
Wulf Ratbane
Adventurer
Maltrok said:
20,000 subscribers = $300,000 revenue per month, $3.6mm per year.
I'm guessing DDO is profitable.
Abstraction
First Post
If only it was Mac-compatible.
wingsandsword
Legend
What about the complete "NGE" rewrite of Star Wars Galaxies? They pretty much made massive mechanics switchovers the size of the 3.5e to 4e switch there.Delta said:
RigaMortus2
First Post
Wulf Ratbane said:
Then you have to factor in all the costs. How much the servers cost, anytime you need to add a server, new parts (hard drives can fail); you have to pay IT people, you have to pay designers to add content, you have to pay tech support, you have to pay GMs, you have to pay rent (where are those servers, not in somebody's garage I don't suppose). There are many costs associated, I don't think 3.6mil a year is all that profitable when there are costs associated with it you still have to factor in.
Wulf Ratbane
Adventurer
RigaMortus2 said:
Gosh, that never occurred to me. Thanks for helping out.
Just to add some more here with this discussion:
I, personally, disagree that the less-than-awesome subscriptions are due to releasing too early. All MMOs do (some more than others) and as a whole, I thought DDO was decently 'okay' at release tech-wise (I got in during closed-beta).
However, while part of me really enjoyed pieces of the game, what kept myself and everyone I have talked to or tried to get to play the game from continuing playing was the game design itself. No amount of polish and bug fixing can cure this.
The combat while having its moments felt the opposite of tactical that you come to think of with D&D. As a caster in that game, I soon gave up trying to cast spells since melee would kill the mob more often than not before my spell was cast. Also, running out of spells created un-fun to the extreme. They made some funky changes to the rules with HP and AC while keeping others. Also the whole sewers for the first chunk of the game among others were all factors.
I personally feel they tried to put the rules too literally into an MMO and tweaked just enough to make it not quite right (I remember as a Bard spending 10 minutes whacking a Kobold while I was on a crate -- I only had to hit him once or twice like you'd expect but he had so much AC that I only had a 5% chance of hitting him ugh). I would have preferred them taking the essence of the feel of D&D and applied that to an MMO. But, as with everything else, that's my opinion.
Others I know wouldn't play it due to the funkiness of casters (I think showing the un-fun of the pre-4ed casting rules), the killing-a-troll-at-level-1 in 2 hits, and just the chaotic weapon swinging no-idea-what's really going on feel of dungeons.
On the plus side:
- I liked the vision of Eberron they had (although I wanted a world not an empty city of tons of sewers)
- I liked the style they used (sans Elf models which ugh -- same with LOTRO on this one!) for the art
- I LOVED their spell effects and the fact that spells that in their description said "creates a black fog blinding everyone" actually does that! (more games need this!)
- I really liked implementing puzzles/non-combat items in dungeons (although many times not to enough effect)
- Same with traps! Traps! (although easily bypassed still)
So, to recap my previous post: DDOv2 -- a fully explorable non-instanced Eberron world with instanced quest lines/dungeons (ala Lord of the Rings Online), 4ed classes/casting rules and more tactics-based combat (slow it down!) and wooo, I'd play instantly! (I also think that many of the changes Turbine made to DDO -- like hp levels -- are taken care of in the 4ed rules so would be easier to do a literal transplanting of the rules -- but they lend themselves to slower/tactical combat not fast-paced button mashing)
Anyway, just thought I'd add some of my thoughts to this!
I, personally, disagree that the less-than-awesome subscriptions are due to releasing too early. All MMOs do (some more than others) and as a whole, I thought DDO was decently 'okay' at release tech-wise (I got in during closed-beta).
However, while part of me really enjoyed pieces of the game, what kept myself and everyone I have talked to or tried to get to play the game from continuing playing was the game design itself. No amount of polish and bug fixing can cure this.
The combat while having its moments felt the opposite of tactical that you come to think of with D&D. As a caster in that game, I soon gave up trying to cast spells since melee would kill the mob more often than not before my spell was cast. Also, running out of spells created un-fun to the extreme. They made some funky changes to the rules with HP and AC while keeping others. Also the whole sewers for the first chunk of the game among others were all factors.
I personally feel they tried to put the rules too literally into an MMO and tweaked just enough to make it not quite right (I remember as a Bard spending 10 minutes whacking a Kobold while I was on a crate -- I only had to hit him once or twice like you'd expect but he had so much AC that I only had a 5% chance of hitting him ugh). I would have preferred them taking the essence of the feel of D&D and applied that to an MMO. But, as with everything else, that's my opinion.
Others I know wouldn't play it due to the funkiness of casters (I think showing the un-fun of the pre-4ed casting rules), the killing-a-troll-at-level-1 in 2 hits, and just the chaotic weapon swinging no-idea-what's really going on feel of dungeons.
On the plus side:
- I liked the vision of Eberron they had (although I wanted a world not an empty city of tons of sewers)
- I liked the style they used (sans Elf models which ugh -- same with LOTRO on this one!) for the art
- I LOVED their spell effects and the fact that spells that in their description said "creates a black fog blinding everyone" actually does that! (more games need this!)
- I really liked implementing puzzles/non-combat items in dungeons (although many times not to enough effect)
- Same with traps! Traps! (although easily bypassed still)
So, to recap my previous post: DDOv2 -- a fully explorable non-instanced Eberron world with instanced quest lines/dungeons (ala Lord of the Rings Online), 4ed classes/casting rules and more tactics-based combat (slow it down!) and wooo, I'd play instantly! (I also think that many of the changes Turbine made to DDO -- like hp levels -- are taken care of in the 4ed rules so would be easier to do a literal transplanting of the rules -- but they lend themselves to slower/tactical combat not fast-paced button mashing)
Anyway, just thought I'd add some of my thoughts to this!
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