Evasion vs Mettle

[Larrin]

it seems that mettle/evasion are really more useful as anti-friendly fire feats. If you have a wizard that attacks fort in area effects alot and they seem to be centered on you alot, take mettle and great fortitude and hopefully you'll live longer......

could be used by a fighter....glue the monsters to you and then have the wizard drop daily spells the fighter can avoid with mettle. Definitely not the best or wisest tactic, but could be fun(ny).

 

[KarinsDad]

could be used by a fighter....glue the monsters to you and then have the wizard drop daily spells the fighter can avoid with mettle. Definitely not the best or wisest tactic, but could be fun(ny).

The problem is twofold with this:

1) All of the Close or Area Miss: Damage powers in the PHB are Dailies. So although doable, it would not be a very frequent strategy.

2) Since we are discussing Dailies here, Dailies tend to be used when the party is facing a more challenging encounter. It doesn't make a lot of sense to target a PC Fighter with a powerful Daily power that might kick his butt when the enemy is more challenging.


It makes more sense for the Wizard to get Arcane Reach and eventually Spell Accuracy as opposed to the Fighter taking Mettle and having the Wizard kick the snot out of him during a challenging encounter every once in a while.

 

[AndrewRF]

Okay, here is some more detailed info:


List of Monsters
Archon: Fire Ash Disciple
Archon: Ice Hailscourge
Archon: Ice Frostshaper
Boar, Thunderfury
Demon: Balor
Destrachan Far Voice
Devourer, Spirit
Dracolich
Dracolich, Blackfire
Dracolich, Runescribed
Dragon: Elder Black
Dragon: Ancient Black
Dragon: Young Blue
Dragon: Adult Blue
Dragon: Elder Blue
Dragon: Ancient Blue
Dragon: Young Red
Dragon: Adult Red
Dragon: Elder Red
Dragon: Ancient Red
Dragonspawn: Redspawn Firebelcher
Drow Arachnomancer
Eladrin: Bralani of Autumn Winds
Elemental: Firelasher
Elemental: Thunderblast Cyclone
Flameskull
Flameskull, Great
Giant: Earth Titan
Giant: Fire Titan
Giant: Storm Giant
Giant: Storm Titan
Hobgoblin Warcaster
Hag, Howling
Kobold Wyrmpriest
Kuo-Toa Whip
Marut Concordant
Mind Flayer Infiltrator
Mind Flayer Mastermind
Naga, Guardian
Orc Eye of Gruumsh
Shambling Mound: Stormrage Shambler
Treant
Wraith, Dread

Breakdown by Tier
Heroic: 7
Paragon: 19
Epic: 17

Breakdown by Defense
AC: 2
Reflex: 24
Fortitude: 13
Will: 4

Breakdown by Usage Frequency
At-will: 6
Encounter: 13
Daily: 0
Recharge : 1
Recharge : 16
Recharge : 1
On Death: 2
Other: 4

Breakdown by Attack Area
Area Burst: 14
Close Burst: 19
Area Blast: 0
Close Blast: 10

 

[Majushi]

Good job! Now get to work on the PHB for all those NPCs/templated monsters out there.

Right. I've gone through the PHB, and these are the results.

There are 34 Class powers that do half damage on missed Area/Close spells.

20 target AC/Ref. 14 target Fort/Will.

All but one of these are dailies (Turn Undead is the only encounter one, and that only works if you're undead) and 6 are paragon path powers.

The Wizard has most, 15 in total. 4 of these are Paragon Path Powers. 6 vs A/R. 9 vs F/W.

Next is the Cleric with 7 total. 4 vs A/R. 3 vs F/W.

Ranger and Paladin have 4 each. All the Ranger ones are vs AC. The Paladin is half and half, one of which is a Paragon Path Power;Challenge the Unjust (vs Will)

The Fighter has two, unsurprisingly they both target AC.

Then Rogue and Warlord, who have 1 each (Blinding Barrage and Cunning Flurry respectively). Both target AC. Cunning Flurry is a Paragon power.

In last place comes the Warlock, with no powers that would trigger Evasion or Mettle should they miss.


Also, there are 15 Area Bursts, 14 Close Bursts and 5 Close Blasts.

The spread by defense shows; 12 vs Reflex, 8 vs AC, 8 vs Will and 6 vs Fortitude.

 

[Aloïsius]

Monsters are only one half of the problem. NPC with class levels are the other.. If you are fighting evil wizards on a regular basis, then evasion and mettle are both good idea.

 

[Majushi]

Monsters are only one half of the problem. NPC with class levels are the other.. If you are fighting evil wizards on a regular basis, then evasion and mettle are both good idea.

Not really, considering there are only 15 Wizard Spells that can affect either Mettle or Evasion.

4 are Paragon Path Powers, i.e. lvl 20 Wizards. You have other things to worry about than half damage at this point...

That leaves:


Freezing Cloud - lvl 1
Sleep - lvl 1


- These two compete with eachoter. I.e. not likely to fight both at the same time.


Fireball - lvl 5
Stinking Cloud - lvl 5


- See above for level 1


Ice Storm - lvl 9
Blast of Cold - lvl 15
Acid Wave - lvl 19
Elemental Maw - lvl 25


Greater Ice Storm - lvl 29
Legion's Hold - lvl 29
Meteor Swarm - lvl 29


- These three compete with eachoter. I.e. not likely to fight all three at the same time.


That means that in reality, a wizard at level 30 will not have more than 8 spells that can be ignored with misses by Mettle/Evasion.
(1 lvl1, 1 lvl5, 9+15+19+25, 1 lvl29, 1 paragon)

Thanks to the restrictions on dailies anyway, there is only a possible 4 he can have. (lvl 30 = 2 at will, 4 encounter, 4 daily, 7 utility)

And he has to have selected those specifically... (although granted, this is where the choice of two from spellbook or even three with Expanded Spellbook comes in handy)

Overall, as Paragon Tier feats, I am unimpressed.

Granted, versus monsters they can be good. But again, they are very situational. If by chance my DM was heavy on the dragons in his campaign then Evasion may be good.

Other than that the two would be a colossal waste of time IMHO...