D&D General Explain Bounded Accuracy to Me (As if I Was Five)

[Micah Sweet]

To hit people over the head?

How would the book be mounted on the club? I'm imaging a fork in the club with a copy of To Kill A Mockingbird wedged into it and tied off.

 

[Lanefan]

How would the book be mounted on the club? I'm imaging a fork in the club with a copy of To Kill A Mockingbird wedged into it and tied off.

Nah - just use the core book from Pathfinder I as is - it's a club in itself.

 

[Willie the Duck]

I think this is one of those cases where we've ended up pretending we're a lot farther apart than we are. IMO everyone knows there's a point too far with agreeing to participate in an activity and then not substantively participating. Also IMO everyone knows that hobby activities do not have requirements on how seriously you take them unless everyone agrees to it ahead of time. I also suspect most groups land on a general accepted set of upper and lower bounds that new people have to figure out*, and conflicts related to someone drifting over those bounds that map to the general quality of conflict resolution a given social circle has. *hopefully with help from the existing participants.

What's the point of a book club if not to read the books and then discuss them?

I don't know why you would join a book club if your goal wasn't to read books and then discuss them. I think the question is -- if you joined one and found you couldn't always read the allotted book in a given week -- would you be considered in violation of an expectation/social contract/doing the rest of the club a disservice?

If there really is demand for an intense, hard-core experience, then why not take the opportunity to form an all Enworlder group here in this thread?
What better place then Enworld is there to find the most hard-core elite high skilled players?

I'm not going to make friends here with this statement. I like this place. I like the people here. However, I have not seen specific evidence* to convince me that it is a bastion of elite TTRPG skill. This makes sense -- there are no qualifications for joining, and the only selection criteria for wanting to join/stick around are enthusiasm for TTRPGs and desire to discuss it. I'm sure many gamer quality metrics that you might define as skills probably do correlate fairly well with dedication or enthusiasm (or those at least are quasi-requirements). Desire to discuss (particularly on a forum platform) seems a lot more loosely linked.
*To be clear, any given forum participant could well be a top 1% gamer, I just don't have sufficient evidence to convince me of it one way or the other.

Cell phones are the ban of my existance. When it comes to gaming, players in our groups know if you "have something going on" you let the group know and handle it (if it happens) quietly and discretely. For things like ordering food, etc., yeah, those can wait until a break.

Oh, certainly, just about anything can be a distraction! Cell phones simply are the primary offenders IME, but I am probably biased.

Look, I'm going to make an exception to my previously stated 'I think this is rare' comment for this one thing. Cell phones and people who cannot stay off them* -- sometimes to the point of being disruptive to those around them**-- are one this decade's major social adjustment points. Doubly frustrating since they are generally not-optional devices for people in the modern world. You are not wrong in this, nor wrong in your frustration. IMO, though, I think it's too universal of an issue to treat it as a RPG issue. Also that it really isn't in the same category of issue as someone not taking the game seriously in other fashions (not knowing the rules, etc.). *especially if they have social media attached to them.
**or themselves, cue anecdotes of people walking into hazards while staring at their phones.

But that said, my point is that you can just have someone prone to distraction. I strongly suspect I'm an undiagnosed case of ADHD (since I was in my teens before it even started to be diagnosed, and adult before it became regularly attended to), and it can make it very hard for me to stay focused as a player, to the degree that if I had nothing else I'd probably just drift off in thought (which I've often found is actually worse than, say, playing a computer game I know well since it'll make me lose the thread completely, as I tend to tune out background sounds when I do that whereas playing the game I'll still have part of my attention to it). Notably I do not have the same problem as a GM.

I was diagnosed as an adult. You should consider looking into it with a behavioral healthcare provider. I found tools and medications that drastically enhanced the quality of my life and the ability to function in my career, volunteer work, etc.

 

[ezo]

Look, I'm going to make an exception to my previously stated 'I think this is rare' comment for this one thing. Cell phones and people who cannot stay off them* -- sometimes to the point of being disruptive to those around them**-- are one this decade's major social adjustment points. Doubly frustrating since they are generally not-optional devices for people in the modern world. You are not wrong in this, nor wrong in your frustration. IMO, though, I think it's too universal of an issue to treat it as a RPG issue. Also that it really isn't in the same category of issue as someone not taking the game seriously in other fashions (not knowing the rules, etc.). *especially if they have social media attached to them.
**or themselves, cue anecdotes of people walking into hazards while staring at their phones.

I agree, except for the first bolded part (which I understand is not related to the issue being discussed, but my personal beliefs!).

I mostly agree with the second bolded part, except it depends on the extent of the disruptions for the different issues. For myself, especially when I am DM, being on your phone to the extent you aren't paying attention (forcing a recap, etc.) is severely disrespectful. DMs have hard (but fun!) jobs without having to repeat themselves or summarize the situation. It is a waste of game time. At least if someone doesn't know the rules well, etc. repetition of looking things up or being explained things might hopefully result in them learning at a future point. So, I place "phone distraction" above lack of rule knowledge.

Now, I understand "in the modern world" a lot of people don't see this as disrespectful, so might feel it isn't such a big deal. However, it is how it makes me feel, and so I express this at session 0 for people new to the group (or whenever they join). If you cannot honor how it makes me feel, you shouldn't play with me. I don't take the personally, it simply means as gamers we won't jive.

 

[pemerton]

I don't think yopu are expected to practice on your own time (or at least I wasn't in 4th grade), you are ex-ected to sing but not to be on key.

I'm certainly not talking about 4th grade choirs. I was thinking about somewhat serious choirs, whose members audition (to establish that they can sing on key) and who are expected to practice, just like musicians in any other group.

Even when I performed with a colleague in a light-hearted valedictory event for our students - a very forgiving audience - I practised in my own time.

I think there is no general assumption that players are supposed to take the game seriously. What I am saying if that is an expectation, that you are a group of "serious" players that needs to be stated up front.

Or perhaps it can be inferred. There are many ways of communicating the culture and expectations.

This sort of attitude that there is a minimal acceptable standard is a form of gatekeeping and one that keeps newbies interested in the game away. It was prevalent in the 90s and 00s but is less so now I believe and I think that is one reason in the explosion of popularity.

Speaking purely for myself, I don't play RPGs so as to grow the market for WotC, nor so as to grow the pool of potential players. I play RPGs for my own enjoyment, and to share something creative with my friends - which is also enjoyable.

For many of those who have joined my RPG group, it has been the fact that we are relatively serious that has been an attractor. They are not looking just to turn up and not be unpleasant. They are looking to turn up and engage themselves in the game.

Which, to be honest, is not all that hard to do. Serious RPGing is not as demanding as (say) serious music.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I'm certainly not talking about 4th grade choirs. I was thinking about somewhat serious choirs, whose members audition (to establish that they can sing on key) and who are expected to practice, just like musicians in any other group.

Even when I performed with a colleague in a light-hearted valedictory event for our students - a very forgiving audience - I practised in my own time.

Or perhaps it can be inferred. There are many ways of communicating the culture and expectations.

Speaking purely for myself, I don't play RPGs so as to grow the market for WotC, nor so as to grow the pool of potential players. I play RPGs for my own enjoyment, and to share something creative with my friends - which is also enjoyable.

For many of those who have joined my RPG group, it has been the fact that we are relatively serious that has been an attractor. They are not looking just to turn up and not be unpleasant. They are looking to turn up and engage themselves in the game.

Which, to be honest, is not all that hard to do. Serious RPGing is not as demanding as (say) serious music.

I think this is the first time I've ever "loved" one of your posts!

 

[Thomas Shey]

I was diagnosed as an adult. You should consider looking into it with a behavioral healthcare provider. I found tools and medications that drastically enhanced the quality of my life and the ability to function in my career, volunteer work, etc.

You may well be right but--I'm going to be 67 in a couple months, and its hard for me to perceive the effort warranted this late in the day.