Hypersmurf said:
Well, I agree that the Flaming Sphere is not the caster causing harm directly. However, it is a spell that opponents resist with a saving throw, which fits the p131 definition of an attack.
Opponents don't resist
the spell with a saving throw; they resist
being touched by a rolling ball of fire with a saving throw, the same way they could jump out of the way of a trap. Reflex
negates damage from
flaming sphere, it doesn't reduce it, nor does it prevent the effect from actually occurring. As I asked my DM, what attacks can be
completely negated by a reflex save?
Invisibility has very specific conditions about what types of spells remove its protection: "any spell targeting a foe or whose area or effect includes a foe".
Flaming sphere doesn't meet the criteria for negation set by
invisibility.
Flaming sphere has no area, it has no target, and its effect is a 5-ft.-diameter sphere. So unless you consider that 5-ft.-diameter sphere to be your opponent, your invisibility should remain intact.
The sphere cannot target creatures (or anything else, for that matter). It simply moves where you direct it, whether there are creatures (either friends, foes or strangers) in the way or not. If there are creatures in the sphere's path (and they choose to stay there), they will get burned. Creatures not moving out of the way, or stepping in the way, no more constitutes an attack on your part than Randy Johnson's pitch constituted an attack on that bird.
If directing a summoned creature doesn't negate invisibility, why should directing a summoned (or evoked) ball of flame? If triggering a trap that sends a mundane or magical burning sphere toward an enemy doesn't negate invisibility, why should sending your own flaming ball? If this were a mundane ignited orb that an invisible caster were manipulating with
telekinesis, would the same arguments apply?
frankthedm said:
The monster is not you, and the actions it takes are because it wants/has to follow your commands.
Neither is the flaming sphere you, but the moves it makes are because it has to follow your commands. Is your concern really over the difference between mental and verbal control? Would it really be any different if the invisible caster were shouting or even whispering to the ball of fire, "Go over there!"
Dracorat said:
magic is an attack on your part any time your spell harms a monster or causes them to make a save, for any reason, including them doing something dumb like jumping through a wall of fire.
So, if I used
fabricate to create a masterwork longsword and then some idiot comes and lops his foot off with it, I just attacked him? With my
fabricate spell??? Cite your source.