D&D (2024) Future-Edition Brainstorming: A Simplified Cosmology (+)

[Yora]

D&D really only uses three or four planes: Abyss, Nine Hells, Celestia, and maybe on occasion Limbo, if they are feeling cute that day.
Throw in a paralel material plane of shadow and fey because people like those, and I think we have everything covered.

So maybe three material planes (Material, Shadow, Fey), three divine planes (Celestia, Abyss, Hell), and a chaos plane to separate the two groups.

 

[Lyxen]

I have page 43 bookmarked.
My point is that I don't consider it guidance. Or at least full guidance.

There should be a stp by step example of creation of a cosmos just like creating a PC or race.

It is step by step, and it even includes examples. Maybe not detailed enough for you, but I guess some people are never satisfied anyway.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

I have page 43 bookmarked.
My point is that I don't consider it guidance. Or at least full guidance.

There should be a stp by step example of creation of a cosmos just like creating a PC or race.

I generally feel that most of the advice in DMG could easily be expanded upon quite a bit. What I'd like to see is some sort of World Builder's Guide that would go more in depth with these sort of things.

 

[Lyxen]

1. Above the gods are 5th dimensional Imps, then above then is the Sixth dimension - the multiverse control room is where the three Monitors watch over reality. The gods are split into fragments, each one exists in every reality- but they can be combined as Darkseid has done. Pre-Crisis Darkseid was bigger than a universe, and when he fell the destruction caused was incalculable. And because you don't know it, you have deemed it useless. Very biased and very small-minded of you.

And here you go, because I don't bow before the awesomeness of something that I don't care about because I don't like DC, I don't like mixing SF like monitors in my fantasy, I'm small-minded. Sue me, but once more, simplification should not be a goal in itself for mythology. See below about Glorantha and myths.

3. I am not saying Glorantha as a setting isn't fun, but the setting is extremely limiting in scope, say compared to DnD.

In some ways, Glorantha is more vast than D&D, because it has a real genesis story, and more than that, that genesis story is shrouded in many contradictory myths that PCs can interact with and modify to tell their own story in god time, with consequence upon the world after time began. It's a brilliant concept that has the added advantage to work really well in game play.

4. This is rubbish statement about it being confidential, of the highest order. The books are readily available on DTRPG, and M&M 2e uses DnD stats too boot.

And that proves the popularity how ? There are myriads of very obscure things on DTRPG, you know, and lots of "things" try to climb out of confidentiality by clinging to D&D.

 

[Rogerd1]

And here you go, because I don't bow before the awesomeness of something that I don't care about because I don't like DC, I don't like mixing SF like monitors in my fantasy, I'm small-minded. Sue me, but once more, simplification should not be a goal in itself for mythology. See below about Glorantha and myths.

In some ways, Glorantha is more vast than D&D, because it has a real genesis story, and more than that, that genesis story is shrouded in many contradictory myths that PCs can interact with and modify to tell their own story in god time, with consequence upon the world after time began. It's a brilliant concept that has the added advantage to work really well in game play.

And that proves the popularity how ? There are myriads of very obscure things on DTRPG, you know, and lots of "things" try to climb out of confidentiality by clinging to D&D.

1. Exactly you're biased, and not open minded. That will obviously mean that you don't like Star Wars, or Esper Genesis then, which mixes SF and Fantasy together.
2. Rubbish. Glorantha lacks the vastness of DnD, nor is it a multiverse.
3. Fact, M&M is a large part of Green Ronin, like a huge following. Then it has the Age setting. Followed by the more recent release Sword Chronicle. They have also written for 5e, 3rd edition and a whole host of things. Everytime you reply you dig a deeper hole...perhaps you should stop digging?

 

[Minigiant]

It is step by step, and it even includes examples. Maybe not detailed enough for you, but I guess some people are never satisfied anyway.

It doesn't go through the steps. That's my point.

It's like giving someone the recipe list but not the recipe instructions.

CHOOSING AN UPPER PLANE
Next well we choose a plane for your celestials. Do you want one upper plane? Two? Four? Infinite? Many setting like the Olympic Cosmos have one upper plane. The Great Wheel has seven. The DMG includes these Upper Planes

Celestia/Heavens
Bytopia/Paradise
Elysium/Blessed Fields
The Beastlands
Arborea/Olympus
Ysgard/Asgard
Arcardia/Kingdoms
Cloudland
The Golden City

In this example we will choose 2 upper planes. Celestia for LG gods and celestials. Arborea for CG gods and celestial. NG gods and celestial will reside in one or the other or both depending on their preferences....

 

[Lyxen]

1. Exactly you're biased, and not open minded.

It's called having tastes. I don't like DC, I don't like the Speed Force, and I don't like it slapped on cosmology which makes no sense to me. Is that allowed ? I don't force you to like the Great Wheel...

That will obviously mean that you don't like Star Wars, or Esper Genesis then, which mixes SF and Fantasy together.

Now you are making really silly assumptions. I've been a Star Wars fan since my mother took me to see it in the cinema, and it's not a problem to me (and neither are Sanderson young adult skyward books) because they are obviously SciFi based even though it's not "hard" SciFi. My problem is more with having a mostly fantasy world where the explanation turns out that it was really (really bad) science because the author cannot imagine things in a purely fantastic way.

2. Rubbish.

Yeh, right. Now, who is biased and not open-minded ?

Glorantha lacks the vastness of DnD, nor is it a multiverse.

I thought "vastness" and complexity were something to be criticised ? As for the "multiverse", well, even wikipedia happens to disagree with you with this citation: "Glorantha is immense. If explored, it has different worlds and dimensions, whole realms where Gods, spirits and sorcerous powers come from." So yes, it is a multiverse, and in particular during heroquests, you explore all the various planes and stories of the gods, and you even create your own.

3. Fact, M&M is a large part of Green Ronin, like a huge following. Then it has the Age setting. Followed by the more recent release Sword Chronicle. They have also written for 5e, 3rd edition and a whole host of things. Everytime you reply you dig a deeper hole...perhaps you should stop digging?

And yet, instead of showing me how large a following it has, you have to refer to other products like D&D and Green Ronin. I like digging into absurd claims like yours.

 

[Lyxen]

It doesn't go through the steps. That's my point.

But it does, it lists the basic elements, then, for example: "putting them into a coherent cosmology is an optional step." and it has quite a few examples, and suggestions, omniverse, myriad planes, etc.

But, once more, some people need to be guided step by step, it's not the purpose of a general book like the DMG to guide you through minute steps of the creation process of your world and its cosmology, especially since many DMs will probably never create one anyway. But some people will go to any length to find reasons to criticise.

 

[Rogerd1]

It's called having tastes. I don't like DC, I don't like the Speed Force, and I don't like it slapped on cosmology which makes no sense to me. Is that allowed ? I don't force you to like the Great Wheel...

Now you are making really silly assumptions. I've been a Star Wars fan since my mother took me to see it in the cinema, and it's not a problem to me (and neither are Sanderson young adult skyward books) because they are obviously SciFi based even though it's not "hard" SciFi. My problem is more with having a mostly fantasy world where the explanation turns out that it was really (really bad) science because the author cannot imagine things in a purely fantastic way.

Yeh, right. Now, who is biased and not open-minded ?

I thought "vastness" and complexity were something to be criticised ? As for the "multiverse", well, even wikipedia happens to disagree with you with this citation: "Glorantha is immense. If explored, it has different worlds and dimensions, whole realms where Gods, spirits and sorcerous powers come from." So yes, it is a multiverse, and in particular during heroquests, you explore all the various planes and stories of the gods, and you even create your own.

And yet, instead of showing me how large a following it has, you have to refer to other products like D&D and Green Ronin. I like digging into absurd claims like yours.

1. Right, and?
2. I am not making any assumptions. Your statement below is you don't like SF mixed with fantasy, it just so happens you used the examples of Monitors. But it is your statement.

And here you go, because I don't bow before the awesomeness of something that I don't care about because I don't like DC, I don't like mixing SF like monitors in my fantasy, I'm small-minded.

Make your mind up.

3 / 4. Glorantha is a square world, floating on a supposedly infinite sea, with the Underworld below, and Heavens above full of gods. No matter how you shake this tree, it will not make it a multiverse under current theories, merely a universe. You clearly have no clue what you are talking about.

5. Green Ronin has written numerous products of its own, and also for established products too.

DriveThruRPG

www.drivethrurpg.com

So at this point you are clearly trolling. If a product line was not as successful as Mutants and Masterminds there would not be as many products available.

 

[Lyxen]

1. Right, and?
2. I am not making any assumptions. Your statement below is you don't like SF mixed with fantasy, it just so happens you used the examples of Monitors. But it is your statement.

No, my statement is I don't like to mix SF in my fantasy, which is not the same thing.

3 / 4. Glorantha is a square world, floating on a supposedly infinite sea, with the Underworld below, and Heavens above full of gods. No matter how you shake this tree, it will not make it a multiverse under current theories, merely a universe. You clearly have no clue what you are talking about.

And not only have you not read the proofs that I've given to you, but it shows that you have no idea what Glorantha is, and in particular the difference between the god time and time, and their simultaneous existence, with all the realms that existed before Glorantha took the shape that it has today. Go read.

5. Green Ronin has written numerous products of its own, and also for established products too.

Great, and because Green Ronin has written many products, it somehow makes M&M 3e more than confidential, especially today when 3e is not played that much, even less derivative games ?

DriveThruRPG

www.drivethrurpg.com

So at this point you are clearly trolling. If a product line was not as successful as Mutants and Masterminds there would not be as many products available.

Look here: DriveThruRPG.com - The Largest RPG Download Store!

Dragon Warriors, a RPG from 1985 which was very confidential, I brought it at the time because it was simple for initiation, and it's still in DTRPG although I wager almost nobody plays it today. What exactly is your problem with M&M 3e being confidential ? I've played confidential games when they were great for our tables...