half-fiend and skillpoints

[kitcik]

[MENTION=78958]Empirate[/MENTION] I agree with everything you are saying 100% as RAI.

I think I finally see what the OP is getting at, though.

He is trying to make a RAW argument that even if the variable HD in the equation (8+int) * (hd+3) is zero, you still get the +3 such that, under RAW not RAI, this template gives you a skill boost.

I am not familiar enough with templates to conclude on this, although your discussion above is clearly RAI.

 

[Empirate]

The "HD+3" is really just shorthand for "quadruple at first level, normal afterwards". It's there for ease of calculation, nothing else. If you don't have racial HD, you don't get (0+3) effective HD for calculating skillpoints.

"...the half-fiend gains outsider skill points only for its racial Hit Dice, and gains the normal amount of skill points for its class levels". Pretty clear-cut. Anybody who'd argue "RAW" as "you gain skillpoints as if you possessed three outsider racial HD you don't actually get" is a munchkin.

 

[Luigiana]

I don't get this at all. You seem to think that the following line means you add hit dice when applying the Half-Fiend template. That is not the case.




You don't get +3 HD from the Half-Fiend template. The template doesn't add any hit dice whatsoever. It just gives you the Outsider type. Outsiders gain a certain number of skillpoints for their racial hit dice. That number is 8, plus your Int mod as per usual for calculating skillpoints.

So, in order to calculate skillpoint gain from racial HD for a Half-Fiend, you take your racial HD only (and only if you have any), add three, and multiply the resulting number by skillpoints/level: 8+Int mod.

The reason you add three to your racial HD when calculating skillpointsis that the first HD counts quadruple for the sake of calculating skillpoints. So the calculation is:
First racial HD gains (8+Int mod) times 4 skillpoints,
all other racial HD gain (8+Int mod) skillpoints.
This results in a total of (8+Int mod) times (HD+3) skillpoints.


To drive it home:
All this is just about calculating skillpoints from racial HD. Humans don't have racial HD after taking up a class, any class. The Half-Fiend template doesn't add, subtract or change a Human's HD because it only affects racial HD.

okay so if i understand it right then a human half-fiend fighter still only gets 2+int mod skill points?

 

[Empirate]

Yes, that's what it boils down to. I could have said so right from the start, I suppose...

 

[kitcik]

okay so if i understand it right then a human half-fiend fighter still only gets 2+int mod skill points?

3 cuz he's human?

 

[Luigiana]

thank you guys