Homebrew alternate history

Bob Mackenzie

First Post
Joshua

Great plot - holds together well :)

Small problem with point 1: its impossible to get an accidental atomic explosion by breaking a bomb. If you want a premature explose it would have to be a faulty arming device

US bombers - historically it was the B29 Superfortress that dropeed the bomb. This was followed by the B50 an improved version. The next bomber after that in the early 50's was the B36. the B1 - historically - is a 1990's bomber

Cheers

Bob
 

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Yeah, thanks. I just threw that atomic reference out there -- some kind of accidental detonation needs to happen. And yikes! I totally knew that the B1 was a "modern" bomber. I don't know what got into me there.
 
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Ender

First Post
Hay I was thinking, maybe Hitler didn't die, or should I say didn't really die. Maybe he felt the heat and being the paranoid and power hungry guy we know he was decided he's had enough of putting his kester on the line (maybe after a few failed, but just barely, assignation attempts?) and decided to kill a few birds with one stone.
After, No during his most poignant speech ever, his podium is engulfed in an explosion and it is reported later that evening that the furrier is confirmed dead. In actuality he fakes his death, thus elevating him to martyr status, and then manipulates the political chaos to promote a hand picked successor, read puppet.
He stalls the war to allow the people to get firmly devoted to both his memory and his successor, but since he is no longer directly in the lime light he gains a greater perspective on the situation. He has another brilliant Idea, he has his successor declare peace (for real this time) to focus on building up the homeland, while he institutes a massive breeding and elimination plan. He slowly begins to churn and repopulate Europe...
 

jonrog1

First Post
Really sterling damn peace of work there, lads. I'm a fan of counterfactuals myself, and you've all done some great work.

A few suggestions for flavor. Anyone more knowledgeable than I in specific factors, please correct and contribute.

-- Kemal Ataturk, Western-style reformer of Turkey, died in 1938, but his unfluence and the influence of his followers could have moderated the development of your proto-Arab world. An eminently reasonable, parliamentary style government under your Arab King could be interesting -- and seeing as they'd be the most stable area in the history, perhaps an occult or psi organization would be better established than in other places.

-- Chang Kai-Shek was one tenacious bastard, and if the Flying Tigers, the American privateer airmen, expanded into a full mercenary expeditionary force (not taken over by the US government as happened because of Pearl Harbor) then there's an interesting, cool, guerrilla force or American legacy in China.

-- U-boats were blowing up ships off the Jersey Shore after war was declared -- giving rise to one of the more interesting little forces in the war, by the way, a ragtag band of private yachsmen who patrolled the Long Island shore. Anyway, aggravated by the increased Lend-lease program, the Germans start poaching closer and closer to the shore breaking into open warfare, perhaps in the Hudson river. Could be another way of dragging the US in against the Germans. After all, Roosevelt was looking for any excuse he could to help the British.

Sounds like a great game -- good luck!
 

Bob Mackenzie

First Post
jonrog1 said:
Could be another way of dragging the US in against the Germans. After all, Roosevelt was looking for any excuse he could to help the British.

Sounds like a great game -- good luck!

US Destroyers were running convoy escort BEFORE December 1941 and engaging German U-boats, so before the official declaration of war there was an unofficial one in the Atlantic

Cheers

Bob
 

Sixchan

First Post
Hmm, what if Roosevelt wasn't president at the time of the Pearl Harbour attack? What if it went right, and it just kept the Americans out, instead of dragging them in?

Hmm...

  • Roosevelt loses Election in America (or, Roosevelt was already dead)
  • Hitler Dies 1941ish Wehrmacht takes control
  • Pearl Harbour is Attacked, Weak-Willed American President gets scared
  • America threatens to stop supplying Britain if it doesn't offer peace to the new Nazi Reigime
  • Peace Talks take place, and the War in Europe ends
  • Germany develops the Bomb, but vows not to use it on Britain except in Self-Defence (as the Brits were pretty close to the top of the Nazi Social Heirarchy). Japan is not given plans. Relations Sour.
  • US develops Bomb, Britain does likewise not long after.
  • New US President begins Influencing South American Governments, many African Colonies not under Nazi Administration join the Brirish Empire/Commonwealth.
  • A Charismatic Muslim Cleric preaches the need to defend Islam from any future Imperialism, citing the success of the Japanese. Muslim countries form into tight alliance.
  • Britain, spared from the wrath of Germany, begins sending military supplies to the Nationalists in China. Mao is killed in an unexpected battle, and a Capitalist, Partially Democratic government grows from the Nationalists. With the Division gone, China begins to halt the Advance of Japan.
  • With the Nazi blockade aganst Britain gone, the Wehrmacht Government sees opportunities to revitalise its almost dying economy. Trading Begins between the Nazis and the British Commonwealh.
  • The Japanese Break off their alliance with Germany, which Germany doesn't mind; the war is mostly over, and the Japanese aren't exacly "up there" when it comes to Racial Purity.
  • With their war slowing to a halt, the British's Pacific Islands better protected from attack, Japan begins to concentrate on Economy.

In this situation (up to about 1947), I believe that Britain would in time become somewhat friendly to Germany if not nominally Allied (W.C. would turn in his grave!), the Commonwealth/Empire would become more Industrial, India would be a Dominion if Not fully independant.
Imperial Japan would in time become an Economic Powerhouse, as attitudes to foreigners would soften once the push let up.
China would also become much more Industrial, and would be allied with the Commonwealth.
The Islamic Empire would be a large target for dirty dealings, and probably economicly open but socially isolationist.
Nazi Germany would be pretty open to the British and Americans ("Racial Purity" and all that :rolleyes:), possibly as I said, nominally Allied, and friendly to the Islamic Empire (the people of the Middle East are, in general, Caucasian, and so probably pretty "Racially Pure").
The USSR is an Enigma. How it fares will depend on may other Factors. Should America and/or Britain be more against Germany than the USSR, then they will be propping it up. If Germany has an Ally in either Britain or America, the Soviet Union will likely have collapsed and Germany will hold as far as the Urals, and Japan will hold much of the East. Unless Germany itself is not propping up a weak Soviet government, as it does not want all that extra territory with all those "Racially Unpure" Slavs, and it doesn't like the idea of Japanese or Chinese Expansion. Of course, all those purges Stalin did could result in someone getting mad. A very early Gorbachev figure could Capitalise the USSR and get great assistance from the US and the Commonwealth.

The Last option would likely mean that all war would be covert, James Bond/Solid Snake style, with possibly small border skirmishes. That is what you're looking for, right?

Wow. I can't believe how long this took! :)

---

Situation in 1947

Red/Pink = Axis countries / Axis Territories
Brown/Orange = Britain+Dominions / Colonies+Commonwealth Countries
Aqua/Cyan = USA / US Puppets
Imperial Purple/Magenta = Japan / Territories
Yellow = China
Black = USSR
Green = Islamic Empire

1947.gif


EDIT: Ack. It didn't attach! Gimmie a sec...
 
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Sixchan

First Post
I've got a blank version, and you can find periodical ones here.

The Above one is modified from the 1941 Axis and Allies map.
 

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Sixchan

First Post
Okay, being more of an Alternate Cartographer rather than an Alternate Historian, I've decided to take the map forward to 2000. I've assumed that the South American countries have in the end joined the United States of the Americas (well, I like that name better), the Islamic Empire is now one Nation instead of an Alliance, and probably an Aristocratic Oligarchy. The Territories of Germany and Japan have now been integrated into their respective empires. I have also added almost all the Cities that could ever be important in a Campaign, Blue Cities being Capitals. The Commonwealth countries don't have their own capitals marked down as capitals, as the countries are very close almost as to make boundaries a mere formality (sort of like Benelux, I think).

In the Second map, the Soviet Union has fallen, and the neighbours have moved in. Central Russia is no longer a real "country", just a lawless criminal hellhole, and no-one really wants central Russia bad enough to go in there anyway. Those cities are shown in red to show revolt/anarchy.


Even if you have you're own system, I'd appreciate further ideas, since I think this is something of a campaign opportunity of my own that I might try as soon as I get a copy of D20 Modern.
 

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