D&D 5E [Homebrew] Defensive Duelist

[clearstream]

of those 2 options I would just let it give the rogues resistance ability if you don't have it and enhance it if you do.

As Uncanny Dodge is not resistance, it would stack with this. Who else would benefit? Sword-and-board Fighters could value resistance as it doubles-down on their better-defense/worse-damage style of fighting. Albeit it then possibly treads on Barbarian toes...

I feel like resistance is a great suggestion. Yet for me not the right direction for this feat in terms of the overall game. That's highly subjective: each commentator will have their own sense of the mechanical gestalt.

Maybe add the proficiency bonus to ac against the attack if you have it and some next turn damage enhancing ability against the enemy that triggers it.

What did you think of @jaelis' step-and-stab?

 

[FrogReaver]

As Uncanny Dodge is not resistance, it would stack with this. Who else would benefit? Sword-and-board Fighters could value resistance as it doubles-down on their better-defense/worse-damage style of fighting. Albeit it then possibly treads on Barbarian toes...

I feel like resistance is a great suggestion. Yet for me not the right direction for this feat in terms of the overall game. That's highly subjective: each commentator will have their own sense of the mechanical gestalt.


What did you think of @jaelis' step-and-stab?

I didn't think it made it very much better. Maybe for a rogue, but that'd be about the only class that might consider taking it then IMO.

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

IMO what versatile weapons need is a separate feat that grants +1 Str and lets you do the 2H damage even while wielding them in one hand.

I'd say personally that what versatile weapons need is an improvement to their use two-handed rather than yet another reason to use then one-handed. The issue with versatile weapons at the moment is that using them two-handed can't compete with using a shield and/or Duelling fighting style.

As Uncanny Dodge is not resistance, it would stack with this. Who else would benefit? Sword-and-board Fighters could value resistance as it doubles-down on their better-defense/worse-damage style of fighting. Albeit it then possibly treads on Barbarian toes...

I feel like resistance is a great suggestion. Yet for me not the right direction for this feat in terms of the overall game. That's highly subjective: each commentator will have their own sense of the mechanical gestalt.

What is your view of what the feat should achieve mechanically, and what do you think it should look like if you saw someone using it in a fight?

 

[jaelis]

I'd say personally that what versatile weapons need is an improvement to their use two-handed rather than yet another reason to use then one-handed. The issue with versatile weapons at the moment is that using them two-handed can't compete with using a shield and/or Duelling fighting style.

Imagine there was a bastard sword that was 1d8 versatile 2d6. I guess that some characters would use it 1H, some 2H, but rarely would anyone go back and forth. Disagree?

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

Imagine there was a bastard sword that was 1d8 versatile 2d6. I guess that some characters would use it 1H, some 2H, but rarely would anyone go back and forth. Disagree?

I'd rather see it as a feat or fighting style rather than creating new weapons.
But I think the point of a versatile fighting style/feat would be to encourage switching between one-handed and two-handed as the situation changes.
I'm not even sure that going from d8 to 2d6 would encourage dropping the AC for a shield. Especially if you factor in Duelling Fighting style.

 

[jaelis]

I guess that is my point: if you don't have a shield, you'll always want to either 2H or TWF. If you have have shield, you'll always want to 1H. I just don't think there is much conceptual or design space for a character that switches back and forth.

Maybe you want a buckler that lets you use both hand to wield, at the cost of your shield bonus for the round?

 

[CTurbo]

I want to start off by saying that I like this feat more than most people. You get to decide to use it AFTER the attack results so it should have a nearly 100% success rate. Causing an attack that would have hit to miss is a damn good use of my reaction. Sure there are other good reaction options, but I will never feel like I wasted my reaction causing an attack to miss me. I mean, that is strictly superior to the Rogue's 5th level Uncanny Dodge IMO. I don't understand the hate.

If I had to nitpick it, I would say that insisting it be a finesse weapon seriously narrow down it's target audience. I could see changing it to any weapon wielded in one hand.


For those who feel like it's too weak and needs more, what about letting it add your prof bonus to your AC until the start of your next turn?

I like the resistance to crit damage, but I feel like granting a free reaction is far too strong.

 

[FrogReaver]

I want to start off by saying that I like this feat more than most people. You get to decide to use it AFTER the attack results so it should have a nearly 100% success rate. Causing an attack that would have hit to miss is a damn good use of my reaction. Sure there are other good reaction options, but I will never feel like I wasted my reaction causing an attack to miss me. I mean, that is strictly superior to the Rogue's 5th level Uncanny Dodge IMO. I don't understand the hate.

If I had to nitpick it, I would say that insisting it be a finesse weapon seriously narrow down it's target audience. I could see changing it to any weapon wielded in one hand.


For those who feel like it's too weak and needs more, what about letting it add your prof bonus to your AC until the start of your next turn?

I like the resistance to crit damage, but I feel like granting a free reaction is far too strong.

So at some point it becomes a free shield spell every turn?

Or rather, in exchange for no reaction you get +4-5 to ac.

 

[FrogReaver]

Maybe: Revised Defensive Duelist

On your turn you may use the defensive duelist action to fight defensively. You gain the benefits of the dodge action until the start of your next turn and can make a single weapon attack as a bonus action during this time. Due to your defensive stance you cannot make opportunity attacks during this time and any enemy that can see you would be aware of this. If an enemy attacks and misses you then you may use your reaction to gain advantage on your next attack against him.

This may be too strong though.

 

[CTurbo]

So at some point it becomes a free shield spell every turn?

Or rather, in exchange for no reaction you get +4-5 to ac.

Well it wouldn't be "free". It would cost a feat to get and a reaction to use, and just like the current feat, it's usefulness would depend on level, and only count against melee attacks.