How many age categories should dragons have?
Gray Lensman
Explorer
I just voted for the super idea
In my campaign world dragons have a different number of age (and max size) categories based on their type.
The Greater Dragons consist of the Blue, Gold, Red, Silver, and Tome Dragons.
Types of Dragons Max Size/Age
Blue Gigantic/Great Wyrm (1200+)
Gold Colossal/Great Wyrm (1200+)
Red Colossal/Great Wyrm (1200+)
Silver Colossal/Great Wyrm (1200+)
Tome Dragons Medium/Great Wyrm (1200+)
The Lesser Dragons consist of the Black, Brass, Bronze, Copper, Faerie, Green and White Dragons.
Types of Dragons Max Size/Age
Black Large/Young Adult (100)
Brass Large/Adult (200)
Bronze Large/Young Adult (100)
Copper Medium/Juvenile (50)
Faerie Dragons Small/Ancient (1000)
Green Large/Young Adult (100)
White Medium/Juvenile (50)
Yeah, I cheated and just cut and pasted from my word doc.
In my campaign world dragons have a different number of age (and max size) categories based on their type.
The Greater Dragons consist of the Blue, Gold, Red, Silver, and Tome Dragons.
Types of Dragons Max Size/Age
Blue Gigantic/Great Wyrm (1200+)
Gold Colossal/Great Wyrm (1200+)
Red Colossal/Great Wyrm (1200+)
Silver Colossal/Great Wyrm (1200+)
Tome Dragons Medium/Great Wyrm (1200+)
The Lesser Dragons consist of the Black, Brass, Bronze, Copper, Faerie, Green and White Dragons.
Types of Dragons Max Size/Age
Black Large/Young Adult (100)
Brass Large/Adult (200)
Bronze Large/Young Adult (100)
Copper Medium/Juvenile (50)
Faerie Dragons Small/Ancient (1000)
Green Large/Young Adult (100)
White Medium/Juvenile (50)
Yeah, I cheated and just cut and pasted from my word doc.
Hriston
Dungeon Master of Middle-earth
It shouldn't need to be. It's color attached to a fun mechanic for generating hit points to provide a rationalization. It can (and should) be replaced with any other reason that makes as much or more sense to the one doing the replacing.
In AD&D, all monsters (except "normal men" and their ilk) have d8's for hit dice, including dragons. For most monsters, every hit point is rolled-up on a d8, and by seeing the result of each roll, or even just hearing the number or general quantity of d8's rolled, the players can know or estimate the hit points of a potential adversary. Dragons are different. You don't know what you're going to get with a dragon because the DM only rolls two d8's and calculates the number of hit points in his or her head. The second d8 determines the dragon's "growth stage", or the number of hit points per hit die, so the number of stages is naturally 8. I believe this innovation was introduced into the game to make it more challenging.
A group that rolls monster hit points at the table could use this method no matter what edition of D&D it's playing. Depending on the size of hit die the dragon uses, the dragon's hit points can be determined by rolling a single die of that type and multiplying the result by the dragon's number of hit dice. This method greatly increases the possibility of encountering a dragons that is either much weaker or much stronger than the normal method would likely yield, and unless the players have memorized the number of hit dice had by each type of dragon, they won't be able to tell which unless they decide to find out by fighting it.
For example, in AD&D, 8 is the perfect number of growth stages due to the use of d8 for all dragon hit dice and the "growth stage" fluff-explanation for the mechanic works just fine, but in 5e (another edition I'm somewhat familiar with) dragons use hit dice from d8 to d20 depending on which size category the dragon fits into. To complicate things, the size category of the dragon is given a coloring rationalization corresponding to the "age" of the dragon, but let's ignore that for now. Each size category has a separate stat-block and can be essentially treated as a separate monster. Thus a dragon wyrmling could be considered to have 8 such "stages", a young dragon 10, an adult dragon 12, and an ancient dragon 20, making for a whopping 50 "stages" for each dragon species. Obviously "growth stage" or age of the dragon no longer serves to explain the mechanic in this case, but relative health or some other colorful explanation could easily be substituted.
To summarize, if your group uses average hit points per hit die or hit points assigned (not rolled) by the DM, then the concept of "growth stage" may not be useful and might as well be assigned to an individual dragon at the DM's whim just like any other element of colorful description. But if your group likes to roll monster hit points a the table and would like to preserve the unique play-experience that dragons had in earlier editions of the game, then rolling a single hit die might be a fun alternative to the norm.
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Celebrim
Legend
I'm afraid you are actually addressing a question about how age categories should be implemented (hit points per hit dice, for example) and not how many there should be.
Technically that's not true. For example Yochlol use d10's.
I assure you, I don't need a primer on AD&D, or the history of dragon age categories.
I'm not asking any questions at all about how you think dragons should be implemented mechanically. I'm asking how many different age categories of dragons - that is to say how many different sizes or degrees of challenge - you feel they ought to have. By implication, I'm also asking something about challenge range and maximum challenge of a 'standard dragon'. Your answer could be based on game reasons like, "I'd like to have a dragon suitable for combat with both 1st level and 20th level parties and some even set of graduations in between", or it could be based on flavor reasons, "The classic eight age categories of 1e AD&D are what I would expect from a rules set, in part because that's how dragons are most commonly described both in my homebrew and in D&D intellectual property.", or some combination of both.
Hriston
Dungeon Master of Middle-earth
I think I was clear in my answer that I think there should be as many "age" categories as the number of results on the dragon's hit die. For example, in D&D (1974), dragons have six levels of maturity because their hit dice are d6's.
Sure, I should have said "most monsters" instead of "all monsters", my mistake. But you bring up a good point here. Mechanics like the yochlol having a larger hit die, or some monsters having a +1 added to their hit point total, are similar to the "growth stage" method of generating hit points in that in a game that features hidden, DM only information, such methods are going to obfuscate the relative challenge the group is expecting to face.
My reply wasn't meant as one. I wanted to give enough background, however, so anyone (not necessarily you) who's interested would know where I was coming from.
If you consider that, at least in some editions, "age category" = number of hit points per hit die, you can see how this is a question about mechanics, the question being, "What range of number of hit points should dragons have for each hit die?" My answer is that I feel that dragons ought to have as many age categories as the number of pips on the highest result of their hit die, or the full range of hit points.
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Argyle King
Legend
Egg
Whelp
Juvenile
Junior
Adult
Elder
Ancient
I was trying to stretch it to 8 to meet one of the choices, but I ran out of steam. "Corpse" for #8?
Whelp
Juvenile
Junior
Adult
Elder
Ancient
I was trying to stretch it to 8 to meet one of the choices, but I ran out of steam. "Corpse" for #8?
In 3.X, my preferred answer is infinite and however many the default PC set has. Infinite age categories by having a continuous progression of age to HD, size, casting and so on, with the PC standard number being actual listed categories. This is to make playing a Dragon far easier. Also, nix the needing XP to age up. Instead, automatically age up and enter XP deficit. Much more sensible, in terms of actual worldbuilding. You can also work out LA by HD to make that more sensible...
