How to add more sorcery points?

[Cap'n Kobold]

What about gaining back points when they roll a natural 20, or a creature targeted by a save spells rolls a natural 1? Not all points each time, but we can work out a normal frequency per fight, figure out what the right amount would be to get roughly the same power as Arcane Recovery, and then adjust from there.

That strikes me as an ideal area in which to have the subclasses differentiate themselves. So each subclass has different abilities to regain some sorcery points designed to reward the use of or behaviour associated with that arcane origin.

So dropping an opponent with necrotic damage might restore a sorcery point for a vampire bloodline.
A phoenix bloodline might regain one if it both restored HP and took fire damage since their last round.
Moving an opponent against their will for a Giant bloodline.
Etc.

(Although different abilities with tighter wording may be required if you haven't fumigated for munchkins recently.)

 

[doctorbadwolf]

That strikes me as an ideal area in which to have the subclasses differentiate themselves. So each subclass has different abilities to regain some sorcery points designed to reward the use of or behaviour associated with that arcane origin.

So dropping an opponent with necrotic damage might restore a sorcery point for a vampire bloodline.
A phoenix bloodline might regain one if it both restored HP and took fire damage since their last round.
Moving an opponent against their will for a Giant bloodline.
Etc.

(Although different abilities with tighter wording may be required if you haven't fumigated for munchkins recently.)

I’d definitely want to keep it to things that the subclass is good at, as well, which I’m guessing we’d agree on.

Maybe have some kind of simple thing that isn’t subclass dependent, to ensure that they’re regaining the right number of points per day?

id also have been ok with Sorcerers straddling the line between long and short rest class, by having sorcery points be a short rest resource.

 

[Sword of Spirit]

(Woops - posted this elsewhere already)

 

[Eubani]

I separate the spell slot recovery from the Sorcery Points. At the cost of 2HD the Sorcerer regains the same number of slots the Wizard does for their recovery mechanic. I also add Themed bonus known spells for the bloodlines.

 

[Maxperson]

For few people. It might work for your group, but IME (playing since 1979), yours is a rare exception then. Yes, combat is only a portion of the game, but it is a significant portion of the game as most of the rules in the book are preoccupied with it. If combat is such a minor portion of your game that it doesn't matter that one class would dominate it, then you are using the wrong game system anyway as there are much much better RPGs that focus on the other aspects than D&D.

No, I'm using the right system, and the reason the books pay more attention to combat than the other portions of the game, is that combat simply requires more rules. It's not because combat is somehow more important. I'm also not a rare exception. Perhaps you just aren't looking in the right places. It has been no problem for me to find groups like this over and over and over again. It has been ages since I've been in a combat focused group.

 

[clearstream]

I am working on an alternate sorcerer to accomplish two things, distinguish it more from wizards and make subclasses feel more distinct.

One of my approaches is to do more with sorcery points. I am giving more metamagic as well as subclass specific abilities that use them.

This runs even harder into the sorcerer's resource management problem. I am looking for suggestions on how to provide more sorcerery points to play with without letting a character just using them all for spells.

Is it class-destroying to remove flexible casting and just give a arcane recovery mechanic?

Sorcerer seems short on points in low tiers, but probably okay for points in high tiers: their points are a crucial component of their game-interest (forcing decisions). I tested a scaling bonus and believe that it isn't a good idea. I tried an ability-linked bonus, but it seemed to help sorcerers that were already in a good place while doing less for sorcerers that needed it more.

My current best guess is that a flat +2 sorcery points at level 2 is about right. No bells and whistles. One way to trial it could be to give the sorcerer a potion that grants these points for an unknown duration. Then if it seems wrong for your sense of balance, you can end the effect.

 

[Sword of Spirit]

their points are a crucial component of their game-interest (forcing decisions)

It's interesting that something you see as part of their game-interest is something I see as a major hassle and decrease in enjoyment. I just want to be able to use my stuff. Deciding which spells to cast in my slots at which levels is decision enough--adding even more dimensions to it is just creating complexity that detracts from the play experience for me.

 

[CleverNickName]

I haven't run into any problems with sorcerer resource management yet, but our sorcerer is still fairly low-level. But maybe you don't need to change the entire class; maybe you could just sprinkle your dungeons with a handful of these?

Potion of sorcery (Uncommon): restores 1 sorcery point when consumed by a sorcerer
Potion of greater sorcery (Rare): restores 3 sorcery points when consumed by a sorcerer
Potion of superior sorcery (Very Rare): restores 6 sorcery points when consumed by a sorcerer
Potion of supreme sorcery (Legendary): restores all sorcery points when consumed by a sorcerer

 

[clearstream]

It's interesting that something you see as part of their game-interest is something I see as a major hassle and decrease in enjoyment. I just want to be able to use my stuff. Deciding which spells to cast in my slots at which levels is decision enough--adding even more dimensions to it is just creating complexity that detracts from the play experience for me.

Games are about constraints, or to put it another way - game rules are constitutive. They create play through what they afford. I mention that to suggest that (as you go on to elaborate) it's not solely that I just want to use my stuff.

For you, it is enough of a constraint to focus on slot use (which arguably could be achieved by playing a wizard, albeit one gives up metamagic). For me, I enjoy the extra dynamic of sorcery points and feel that their fungibility with slots and expenditure in metamagic adds a lot of game-interest.

I wouldn't say either is right, or even exclusive. Possibly my proposed +2 sorcery points from level 2 would do something to enable your preference, without disabling mine.

 

[WaterRabbit]

No, I'm using the right system, and the reason the books pay more attention to combat than the other portions of the game, is that combat simply requires more rules. It's not because combat is somehow more important. I'm also not a rare exception. Perhaps you just aren't looking in the right places. It has been no problem for me to find groups like this over and over and over again. It has been ages since I've been in a combat focused group.

It is not just the books, it is the published modules, it is gaming conventions, etc., etc. I have played with plenty of groups in which combat is a small part of the at table experience -- just not with D&D. The reason is that most of the features that define a class are combat focused -- especially in this version of the game.

The fact that you want to change how the Sorcerer class works demonstrates that D&D isn't the best system for limited combat groups as the Sorcerer class is all about combat and has little utility outside of it. It seems to me that if you want to tweak the Sorcerer class, they should have more out of combat utility perhaps by granting some utility spells for the subclasses in much the same way clerics get domain spells.

Again, I have run/played with the same exact group of people in both D&D and the Storyteller system. D&D always generated more "roll-play" than Storyteller which was much more "role-play". Same with Shadowrun, I have seem much more focus on roleplay with several sessions going by without combat. Yet the same exact people (which by nature were more focused toward roleplay, then being part of a LARP) when sitting down to D&D were much more combat oriented.

To each their own.