D&D 5E I Don't Like Damage On A Miss

[Fifth Element]

There IS however a tradition of DR/-, and untyped damage.

But sure, yeah... we'll just ignore it ever existed to help your point in relation to an example concerning superman..

*facepalm*

Facepalm indeed. DR in that form only exists in 3E. Or 3.5 actually, isn't it? 4E's resistance doesn't work that way, and pre-3E there was immunity to certain types of weapons, but no damage reduction.

But here you are, assuming that if the 5E rules text doesn't specifically rule out something from 3.5, then it must be so. You have no basis whatsoever for that assertion. Especially since we don't even have the actual rules text for the reaper ability, just the summary provided on the character sheet.

 

[AngryMojo]

So... I'm a human commoner who has lightning fast reflexes, and by lightning fast... I mean I'm literally "The Flash". I can move faster than the speed of sound.

But I JUST got my powers, so I still have the hitpoints of a level 1 commoner. We'll say 3 because of my sickly con because I did a lot of meth when I was younger or something.

Now, despite having an AC of 99 the Reaper can murder me without question. I simply can't beat him. If I'm standing next to him at the end of combat, despite being able to watch him swing his axe, eat a hamburger, drink a milkshake, and debate the virtues of Oprah's marriage... and then step out of the way at my leisure.

As a side note, and somebody who gladly purchases his copy of The Flash every month, I can't help but notice this.

http://www.crisisoninfinitemidlives.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/Flash6-2.jpg

So yes, a particularly experienced fighter can land a hit on The Flash. And they typically do. In almost every issue.

Especially considering HP loss isn't "You got hit!" so much as "Something happened to decrease your combat longevity!," I don't understand the reason to get so worked up about it. I mean, if you really don't like it just don't use it.

 

[VannATLC]

Dodge? Maybe. Speed is not accuracy. Speed is not flexibility or control.

Information Processing is intelligence and wisdom. Speed is its own statistic. Dexterity is representative of control, flexibility, accuracy and reactions.

 

[Herremann the Wise]

I fought a guy like that once. Broke my nose by driving the rim of my shield into the faceplate of my helmet. There's no way that was a 'hit' from a greatsword, but I could easily buy that as 3 or 4 damage.

Would you say though that your opponent missed? Obviously not. Again I can't help but think that Armor as DR would be better at reflecting this than a system where missing is a confusing combination of real missing and glancing blows that normally don't affect hps (but that perhaps should).

It would seem that there are three situations here:
1. Genuine Missing (not hitting Touch AC)
2. Glancing Blows (hitting but not dealing hp damage)
3. Genuine Hits (hitting AC and dealing hp damage)

In this context a slayer should do 0hps in situation 1, STR mod in 2, and normal damage in 3. Essentially my issue (as well as others who have concern with the Reaper ability), is that Reapers do STR mod damage in situation 1 when they should not.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise

 

[jadrax]

As a side note, and somebody who gladly purchases his copy of The Flash every month, I can't help but notice this.

Yes, actually the example works quite well. The Flash has low hit points and huge AC, but Owlman has the Slayer Feat and thus punks the Flash... every.. single... time.

 

[slobo777]

It would seem that there are three situations here:
1. Genuine Missing (not hitting Touch AC)
2. Glancing Blows (hitting but not dealing hp damage)
3. Genuine Hits (hitting AC and dealing hp damage)

I think that is getting into very literal interpretations of game mechanics here.

Probably the majority of HP damage to living, non-magical creatures should come under Glancing Blows for example, regardless of the "hit" or "miss" from the D20 mechanics. Especially at higher level play.

That's because real physical injury from a weapon strike would most often disable a medium-sized or smaller creature.

Other game systems simulate this difference in more detail. D&D has always gone for more of a game mechanic, and bundled all sorts of concepts - including stuff that contradicts - into hit points.

The cost is if you think about hit points and hit/miss too hard it doesn't make much sense. IMO this is where parts of this thread are heading.

The benefit is that it's playable as a game, and keeps the heroics going (where other systems might give a severed leg, with half movement and -3 to defences for remainder of the short life of the character).

 

[Empath Negative]

Well the silliness of all of this is that even though it all kinds of wrecks disbelief... people are intent on keeping it in...

 

[VannATLC]

It breaks no more disbelief than operating off a single dice roll, to determine whether or not you land a blow in 6 seconds of time.

 

[jadrax]

Pedantry alert, but people need to use 'breaks belief', or 'wreaks belief', unless you are saying you think totally destroys your ability to *not* believe in something.

 

[Quickleaf]

It does seem a bit odd for an axe wielder to deal damage when they miss with a swing, yes. Now if it were a greatsword wielder, that would be a different situation. Real world greatsword fighting involved pommel strikes, crossguard defensive attacks, punches, elbow strikes, and other secondary sorts of attacks that generally are less lethal than the pointy slashy end. So that would be a reasonable explanation for why a proficient greatsword fighter would inflict damage when they miss. However, a big old axe I don't think is wielded that way... could be wrong though.