Immediate Reaction Now?

[Lord Xtheth]

If my players had this sort of thing happen, and it came down to "Can I move out of the way to let the monster fall into the big ol' pit of fire?" I think a skill challenge would be in order.

difficulty 1 (maybe) 4 successes before 3 failures
Attack roll vs. Reflex: To guide the monster in the direction you want
Initiative Vs. Init.: To see if you can react in time
Acrobatics DC 15 to get significantly out of the way
Success: The monster plummets into the fire!
Failure: The monster stops sliding in front of the blocking PC and gets an opportunity action.
XP: (I don't know) 500?

 

[Soel]

As for the monster, he can't be forced somewhere he couldn't get to by walking normally.

That part (and squeezing in general) is in reference to terrain features and not creatures. Forced movement is allowed through allies, so no special power is needed in the op's case at all. Squeezing doesn't even come into play.

 

[LightPhoenix]

Forced movement says that a creature cannot enter a space that it could not be enter by walking, and you cannot walk into an enemy's space, but I would allow the ally to temporarily designate the monster an "ally" for the duration of the forced movement.

Absolutely not. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. The rules are very clear on forced movement; the enemy can't enter the square, so he can't be pushed through it. Enemies are enemies; you don't get to arbitrarily change that, especially in the middle of an attack.

 

[Nightson]

I would definitely allow it.

Allies can pass through your square. Enemies cannot. This clearly indicates to me that it's up to you whether to allow someone through your square.

And I also have issues with realism at certain levels. Sure I can imagine a medium sized creature stopping another one forced movement wise, but when you get up to colossal and such? That presents issues to me

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Is there anything in 3E or 4E that allows a PC to make an immediate reaction as an interrupt?

Example: in a 4E game, the wizard thunderwaved the monster toward the wall of flame. But the monster was large and didn't squeeze past another PC who was in the way. With an immediate interrupt, the PC in the way could have moved out of the way instantly--allowing the monster to burn in flames as it so richly deserved.

In my opinion, this is the sort of thing one could spend an action point to do. Alternately, a PC could sacrifice his next action to do something like this. His choice of actions would be limited, though.

Thoughts? Houserules? Monkeys?

Well, aside from the fact I'd probably just allow a character to forgoe his AoO* to freely step out of the way as a houserule anyway...

I'm sure there's lots of things in the 3E rules to allow for an immediate movement. The two that happen to come to mind for me at this time of night, though, are the following:

Abrupt Jaunt Conjuror variant from PHB 2: Immediate action teleport 10 ft. Not sure if it can be used on an ally, I've only ever seen it used when a wizard was saving his own bacon.

Evasive Reflexes feat from Tome of Battle: Lets you take a 5 ft step instead of an AoO whenever someone provokes one from you.
(There are stances and maneuvers in ToB to also get immediate action or reactive 5 ft steps or movement, too)

*You get an AoO for an enemy moving through your threatened space, normally. With forced movement it's not always the case, but bull rushing someone certainly makes them provoke in 3E, for one thing. In any case, they're coming at you...as long as you threaten the square in front of you, as it's leaving that square and before it actually enters yours, you get your AoO.

 

[MortalPlague]

Allies can pass through your square. Enemies cannot. This clearly indicates to me that it's up to you whether to allow someone through your square.

That's my interpretation as well. I'd agree that it's up to the player whether or not the movement is blocked. Even if it's not the RAW, it makes things more fun.

 

[Peraion Graufalke]

Eh? I'd say the fairly common Immediate Interrupt fulfills the "make an immediate reaction as an interrupt" criteria. Unless I'm missing something obvious, and my players are cheating all the time.

Immediate reactions take place after the triggering action has been resolved.
Immediate interrupts, well, interrupt the triggering action before it is resolved, and the triggering action is resolved after the interrupt.
If I understood the OP correctly, he's asking for a way to change an immediate reaction into an immediate interrupt.

 

[Peraion Graufalke]

Yeah, by RAW I was mistaken. You can't push an enemy through an ally's space. Treat my initial post as "that's how I'd handle it".

 

[MatthewJHanson]

Absolutely not. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. The rules are very clear on forced movement; the enemy can't enter the square, so he can't be pushed through it. Enemies are enemies; you don't get to arbitrarily change that, especially in the middle of an attack.

I disagree that the rules are very clear. Yes they say that you cannot normally enter an enemies square. They even define an enemy as "a creature or creatures that aren't your ally" (PHB 57), but they do not define what an "ally" is (other than you are not your own ally).

Are NPC bystanders allies? What about a creature who had been working with you, but plans to attack you on its next turn?

If it was clear, I do not think there are would be multiple thread in the rules forum debate who is an enemy and who is an ally. Here are just two for starters:
http://www.enworld.org/forum/4e-discussion/271991-what-enemy.html
http://www.enworld.org/forum/4e-discussion/268902-dominated-ally-still-ally-purpose-powers.html

 

[TarionzCousin]

If I understood the OP correctly, he's asking for a way to change an immediate reaction into an immediate interrupt.

Actually, no. I was just trying to move my character out of the way. I didn't have any immediate reaction powers.

In any event, my time machine is broken. I can't travel back and argue with the DM. But the next time I'm in a similar situation, hopefully I'll position my character better.

Thanks everyone.