Is the Feeblemind spell fair?

[Twowolves]

I once had a wizard character I was playing get Feebleminded by an opposing wizard. Thing was, the bad guy was under Improved Invisibility, and my character was the only one with See Invisible up. The DM ruled that I could indeed "defend myself" with my staff, so everyone else saw my character go slackjawed-drool-on-himself-stupid, then run (well, fly, actually) around the room swinging his staff at apparantly empty air. It had the desired effect, however, as they could target the square my character was attacking (50% miss, but better than 100%) or pelt the area with AoE spells.

 

[Sejs]

(Baleful Polymorph) for the most part prevents most standard actions (except for Psionic types and Druids with the Natural Shape feat). But, BPed targets can at least think, run away, hide, etc. And, Dispel Magic or Break Enchantment can negate it.

Actually, come to think of it, I'm not so sure Natural Spell lets you cast spells if you've been Baleful Polymorphed. Natural Spell does specify it works when you take on a wild shape, and BP states you take on all the statistics of the new form.. which would include mental attributes.

Pretty rough, really.

 

[HeapThaumaturgist]

It's a pretty fair 5th level spell ... requires you to be a 9th level caster to use it.

Now, say, you've got monsters for a 13th level party that have Feeblemind as a Gaze attack and you throw them at the party in bucketfuls?

--fje

 

[Talic]

Fair? Maybe, maybe not. But really I think of it more of a "ruin-a-player's-fun" spell. In our group, it's become one of those D&D nuklear weapons WotC talked about a while back. Nobody wants to touch it.

I'd rather have my mage outright killed than hit with a feeblemind.

 

[frankthedm]

Fair: Reasonable within the scope of the rules and within the realities of play. If the spell is viewed as a nuclear option reserved for mutually assured destruction, that sounds like a vote for unfair. If the effect is too strong to replace the [presumably balanced] death effect gaze of a Bodak, again, a vote for unfair. If you would, as DM, hold back and have the NPC chose a different spell when the "ruin-a-player's-fun" Feeblemind spell IS the best choice, that's another vote for Unfair.

pure core D&D where a Heal spell costs only 660 gp and is available on the equipment and services charts in the PHB, it's really no big deal.

No big deal? A Large city might have a cleric, a cleric that might be willing to help you dependant on alignment and if the cleric feels returning an arcane caster to power constitutes a "dangerous consequence". A selection of 11th level clerics would take a metropolis to reliably have. The players don’t have guaranteed access to spell casters, the rules just provide a way to manage the access.

Spell: The indicated amount is how much it costs to get a spellcaster to cast a spell for you. This cost assumes that you can go to the spellcaster and have the spell cast at his or her convenience (generally at least 24 hours later, so that the spellcaster has time to prepare the spell in question). If you want to bring the spellcaster somewhere to cast a spell you need to negotiate with him or her, and the default answer is no.

The cost given is for a spell with no cost for a material component or focus component and no XP cost. If the spell includes a material component, add the cost of that component to the cost of the spell. If the spell has a focus component (other than a divine focus), add 1/10 the cost of that focus to the cost of the spell. If the spell has an XP cost, add 5 gp per XP lost.

Furthermore, if a spell has dangerous consequences, the spellcaster will certainly require proof that you can and will pay for dealing with any such consequences (that is, assuming that the spellcaster even agrees to cast such a spell, which isn’t certain). In the case of spells that transport the caster and characters over a distance, you will likely have to pay for two castings of the spell, even if you aren’t returning with the caster.

In addition, not every town or village has a spellcaster of sufficient level to cast any spell. In general, you must travel to a small town (or larger settlement) to be reasonably assured of finding a spellcaster capable of casting 1st-level spells, a large town for 2nd-level spells, a small city for 3rd- or 4th-level spells, a large city for 5th- or 6th-level spells, and a metropolis for 7th- or 8th-level spells. Even a metropolis isn’t guaranteed to have a local spellcaster able to cast 9th-level spells.

 

[Plane Sailing]

I voted unfair because of the penalty for arcane casters (and I think divine casters already get too good a deal on everything at the moment - this is adding injury to insult!)

It isn't a major concern, but it has always niggled that feeblemind was extra-nasty against arcane casters.

Cheers

 

[Maldor]

I know this is off topic a little but i like to hit someone with feeblemind then a spell or poison that deals Int or Cha damage. Poof coma min 1 day. if your a neco you can use undead to.

i personal think feeblemind is a powerful 5 lvl but is reasonable compared to other upper 5 lvl spells.

 

[Infiniti2000]

What happens with the spellcaster's spells prepared/slots available after he fails to save vs. feedblemind and then say gets immediately healed? Are those slots again immediately available? Are spells prepared lost until he preps again? IMO the decision on that is a big factor in deciding if this spell is fair. If those spells are not lost, then feeblemind IMO is fair. I'd much rather spend the time/money on a heal rather than 5 times as much on a raise dead and lose a level.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

What happens with the spellcaster's spells prepared/slots available after he fails to save vs. feedblemind and then say gets immediately healed? Are those slots again immediately available? Are spells prepared lost until he preps again? IMO the decision on that is a big factor in deciding if this spell is fair. If those spells are not lost, then feeblemind IMO is fair. I'd much rather spend the time/money on a heal rather than 5 times as much on a raise dead and lose a level.

Prepared spells are prepared spells. There are very few ways to lose prepared spells -- level drain, death, spellthief, any others? A reduced spellcasting stat is not one of them under the RAW. There are no logical problems under the RAW with having a prepared spell that you can not legally cast at the moment.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Prepared spells are prepared spells. There are very few ways to lose prepared spells -- level drain, death, spellthief, any others? A reduced spellcasting stat is not one of them under the RAW. There are no logical problems under the RAW with having a prepared spell that you can not legally cast at the moment.

What about spells in bonus slots that only exist due to ability score?

-Hyp.