D&D 4E Mecha in 4E

[Aeric]

I'm gearing up for my first 4E campaign and I need help coming up with stats for what are essentially mecha.

Here's what I've come up with so far:

• The mecha are magical constructs that require a pilot to perform any actions.
• They have their own physical attributes and defenses, but use the pilot's mental attributes and defenses.
• The pilot can use a few basic attacks (such as slam) with the mecha, but if he is "attuned" (a plot device, will prob. end up a feat) to it, he can channel his own powers and exploits through the mecha. These powers will scale appropriately.

I also want to create a paragon path available to all classes which focuses on using the mecha to its full potential.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

 

[fissionessence]

Sounds pretty simple to me. Did you want to penalize PCs at all for operating this mecha? For example, do they have to make skill checks or anything to operate it? Any other kind of penalties when operating?

If not, you basically just need a monster stat block for each mecha, and then just give it to the PCs to use instead of their own character sheet. Also, I'll assume that these mechas are large or huge, so the PC kind of gets bigger.

It seems like the PCs will end up having better physical defenses, because presumably the mechas would be better armored than a given PC. Then again, you might have to determine that the mecha has hit points all its own. Unless there's a protective area to the piloting portion, the PC operating a mecha might be affected by the same burst or blast attack. Otherwise, the only thing that would damage a PC in a mecha would be an attack vs. Will.

Are there any other benefits you wanted these mechas to grant the players? If they have the feat and use their own powers 'through' the mecha, does the mecha give them any bonuses for doing so? Penalties?

~

 

[Nytmare]

What do you want the power jump to be between characters in and out of their suits?

 

[Sigurd13]

By way of clarification, let me ask which of the three following views best represents the nature of Mecha in your game:

1) Mecha are so much a part of the theme and setting of your world that EVERY FIGHT, EVERY ENCOUNTER, EVERY MOMENT will be spent inside of a mecha.

2) Mecha are more like magical items (or vehicles) that the characters get into and out of often but combat always occurs at the same scale. When characters are in mechs, they ALWAYS fight other mechs or monsters approximating mechs (like in Power Rangers or Voltron). Likewise, when they’re not in mechs they fight normal monsters.

3) Mecha are more like magical items or vehicles that characters get into and out of. However, there will be times when normal characters will have to fight Mecha sized monsters or when the characters will have mechs and the enemies won’t.


Depending on which of these is most true for your game, will depend on how much detail you’ll have to add, how many rules you’ll have to write and how much you’ll have to worry about game balance.


FIRST STATEMENT MOST TRUE
If the first view is more true, then there is really no need to change anything except your perspective. Characters start out as mecha pilots and are assumed to always be in a mecha. The powers they gain are maneuvers they unlock, install, upgrade to, etc. Items become parts and attachments. Crossbows and bows become guns, swords become... well, they stay swords, but now they're giant MECHA-swords! You get the idea.

Going this route, all that really changes is the paradigm in which you present the rules to your players. Essentially no rule changes. The most you *may* have to do is create rules for when the characters, on those rare occasions, are acting 'outside' of a mecha- what happens when a character must eject, what happens when the mecha is destroyed, etc.
Of course, you could just RP all these encounters as skill challenges- so you wouldn't have to deal with non-mecha combat.



SECOND STATEMENT MOST TRUE
If the second view point is more true, then you're going to have to worry about the actual design of the mechs. To this end, ask yourself what's the functional difference between a character and a mech?

If you're going to keep mecha fights between like opponents then you don’t have to worry about scale because the power of the characters will always be relative to the power of the monsters. After all, if a character climbs into a mecha it's already assumed that their powers and capabilities are going to be enhanced greatly. You don't need bonuses to represent that.

That said, I would try to keep the difference basic. Make the 'mecha' just a template- a set of bonuses and extra powers that the character gets while piloting. This way, if a mecha is of a different type than the character, then you can make bonuses to represent this difference. If you climb into a tough mecha, you get a bonus to AC and Fortitude. If you climb into a speedy mecha, you gain a bonus to initiative and speed. This way the characters are still their characters, they just have different bonuses and powers (like magic items!) while in their mechs.



THIRD STATEMENT MOST TRUE
This is the hardest, most involved view point. If there’s a chance that during any combat encounter that one side of the battle does NOT have mechs, you are going to have to do a full write up for the mechs AND worry about scale.

After all, if the characters with mechs fight a band of orcs without mechs, the characters are going to slaughter them. It wouldn’t make sense for a group of level 8 orcs with spears and axes to pose a serious threat to a group of mechs, - EVEN IF THEY ARE ALSO LEVEL 8!

If this is the route you’re going for, then I agree with what FissionEssence said- represent the mechas as monsters that the characters play when inside. You’d essentially need to write up new, higher level monsters for the characters to control during ‘mecha combat.’

Hope this helps.

 

[Aeric]

Fissionessence: I am going to give the pilot an armor check penalty that also affects attack rolls, initiative, and reflex defense. -5, perhaps?

The mecha are Huge, and they have their own AC and hit point total independent of the person piloting it. Once the pilot becomes attuned to the mecha, he will be able to modify the HP total by using his own, but he will also take a percentage of the damage the suit suffers as a result. The attunement will also remove the armor check penalty, and it is a prerequisite for casting spells through the mecha.

Nytmare: Good question. The rough draft of the mecha is a level 15 solo, but I may drop it down to 12. As mentioned earlier, these things are Huge, and are designed to be used as mobile siege engines. Infantry is of little use against them, so I may give the suits damage resistance as well.

Sigurd13: A mixture of #2 and #3, but mostly #2. The first few sessions will mostly involve the PCs running away from the invading army's mecha, followed by an adventure designed to get their hands on one (or more) of the mecha, after which point it will be mostly man-vs-man or mecha-vs-mecha. This is D&D, however, so I expect that the PCs will reach a certain level where they can feasibly take on one or more of the grunt-level mechs without having to get into their own suits.

Hope that answers your questions, guys. Thanks for giving this so much thought!

 

[Starfox]

I would do a mech as a template. The mech has 4x your hp, does five times the damage, 5 points worse AC and to hit, resist all damage 10 etc. This way, they scale automatically as you level up.

 

[Eric Finley]

Just as a thought... if #2 is going to be primary, why don't you just use a variation on Sigurd's excellent suggestion for #1, and use it in parallel with normal characters for #2?

Basically, everybody has two PCs. One is their human stats. And the other is their mech. They level up in tandem, but they're essentially handled as different characters. Mech-scale HP are simply not the same as human-scale HP, there's no real comparison.

For those instants when you're dealing with situations of human-versus-mecha, those'd have to be basically custom monsters. PC uses his human stats; enemy mecha is built as a monster, probably a high-level solo or something, on human scale. Use the normal rules to make it an appropriate challenge... make it the kind of brute which has inaccurate attacks (sometimes with a little bit of "on a miss" splash damage) with horrific damage. Most of what you're catching as a human is blast radius and near-misses; a direct hit is essentially fatal. But balance that into the monster design just like you would any other monster.

Alternate with simply using skill challenges with the mecha chasing (etc.) the puny humans as the backdrop. A "succeed at this skill challenge or you'll have to fight the enemy mech without your own mechs (or surrender)" is perfectly reasonable, if nasty.

Then it's just massive reflavoring between the two. Maybe you insist that they have the same Int, Wis, and Cha; maybe not, maybe the reflavoring makes Int into "Targeting Computer" which could be entirely different from the driver's Int. Maybe you insist they use the same classes, maybe not (I would go with not, personally - some neat juxtapositions there).

And so forth.